Stealing Questions (Weight Checks and Flags)

[Elk Eater]

I have a couple questions about stealing:

1) Using the random stealing feature, I was under the impression that a weight check on the item should not be performed, therefore allowing attempts on items of 0 stone (runebooks) and >10 stone (halberds). I tried this on a halberd (character with just a hally in its pack) and it still says to heavy to steal. Is this correct?

2) When attempting to steal an item that is too heavy to steal, it triggers the permagrey flag, is this correct?

Thanks!
EE

[Grifty McGrift]

I also tried stealing a halbred on an alt using the steal random command, but had no luck. I tried it countless times, with only a halbred in the pack, and was never able to sucessfully steal it.

[chumbucket]

There is a 10 stone limit, regardless of targeting or random. You can definitely steal 0 stone items with random. I know it is a dumb mechanic, but such was UO in era.

I think, but can't say for sure, that a failed steal--even of something too heavy to steal--results in permagrey.

[Grifty McGrift]

What items are worth stealing with a 0 stone weight?

[corruption42]

What items are worth stealing with a 0 stone weight?

Runebooks. I can't think of anything else, but runebooks can be quite... profitable.

[Elk Eater]

I know that there exists the 10 stone limit, my question is more along the lines of accuracy because I thought the demo code allowed attempts at heavier items when random stealing.

Anyone know where I can get the demo installer (I know where all the decompile and deobfuscate tools are)

[Still Standing]

Failing on an item that is too heavy will result in perma grey even if you are suspended from the guild and attempt to steal you will turn perma

[Elk Eater]

According to the wiki here:

http://wiki.uosecondage.com/Rune_book

runebooks are stealable if random stealing. I'm assuming this is due to the bypass of the weight check when random stealing which should lead to stealing overweight items (by random stealing) possible. Am I missing something?

Edit: also in a (rather old) quote from Kaivan here:

viewtopic.php?f=11&t=7787

it is stated that stealing overweight items should be possible. Has something changed since then, or new information been found?

[Kaivan]

I can't be sure whether we have still have any code to deal with stealing items greater than 10 stones, but at the time, we based our mechanics off of the theory that weight checks weren't done for items weighing more than 10 stones and less than 0 when the theft was random. Of course, at the time, we didn't have access to the scripts, and thus, did not know that non-stacked items weighing more than 10 stones were explicitly exempt from stealing attempts. Since then, there may have been changes to only allow theft of runebooks on a random theft attempt, since we knew more about the way in which the scripts handled theft of items which allowed for that type of distinction.

As for stealing an item that weighs more than 10 stones. You should not go perma-gray for attempting to do so. If you can't try to steal an item, you can't be held accountable for it.

[Elk Eater]

Thanks for the info! In regards to this:

As for stealing an item that weighs more than 10 stones. You should not go perma-gray for attempting to do so. If you can't try to steal an item, you can't be held accountable for it.

This is definitely not the way it is operating right now on UOSA. As a test just now I did the following:

1) Innocent non-thief attacks a fresh resurrected innocent thief. The innocent character turned grey, which is correct and expected.

2) Waited 2 minutes for the non-thief character to return to innocent status.

3) Both characters once again innocent, the thief attempted a targeted steal of a halberd from the non-thief. This failed with a too-heavy to steal message. This is where things got really interesting.

After the attempt to steal, from the perspective of the thief, both the non-thief and thief are innocent.

From the perspective of the non-thief, the thief is grey! Not only does he appear grey, but he remains so long after the two minute timer is up (hes perma grey and visible as perma grey to the victim!?) The non-thief did not receive any console messages regarding the attempt.

To validate that he was indeed permagrey, i waited a few minutes and attacked with the non-thief. The non-thief was not flagged as a criminal.

[Ganklord]

Elk Is Right. That's Too Heavy To Steal Turns You Permagray.

[Elk Eater]

The use of disguise kits is also buggy, I haven't had a chance to fully test the parameters that causes the following condition, but something like this happens:

My thief is innocent, uses a disguise kit, goes out and does some thieving. I kill myself to drop my permagrey flag, and go back out a second time (once again innocent). I go back again to drop my flag and kill myself. When I resurrect the disguise kit is no longer in effect. (This may take 2 or 3 or 4 resses, but the disguise kit wears off way before the 2 hour mark, sometimes as short as 15-30 minutes when doing this)

The weirdest part though is that even though I've killed myself and ressed, somehow the permaflag has stuck around because I am able to be attacked freely by other folks.

Another strange symptom if this is that when I go back and kill myself again (to remove the permaflag that shouldn't be there) as soon as I die I am still innocent. Typically if you are perma-flagged, when you die you turn grey and have to wait the 2 minutes to turn innocent again.

Very strange!

[Kaivan]

Regarding the loss of the disguise kit on death, you should lose your disguise kit any time that you die. It sounds like it might be a little buggy in the sense that you don't lose your disguise kit properly on the first death. I'll test to see if that's the case.

However, regarding being attacked after losing your perma-gray status due to a previous death, I would advise testing this in controlled circumstances. It sounds as if someone is simply attacking you, knowing that you're a thief, and without controlling the factors, we can't know if that is or isn't the case.

[Elk Eater]

However, regarding being attacked after losing your perma-gray status due to a previous death, I would advise testing this in controlled circumstances. It sounds as if someone is simply attacking you, knowing that you're a thief, and without controlling the factors, we can't know if that is or isn't the case.

This is what I originally thought until the folks were not being flagged -- I'll try to get some solid tests in place and get back to you.

Edit: Also, any info on the first tests I ran regarding stealing too-heavy items?

[Elk Eater]

I haven't had a chance to test the other things yet but this is something that happened to me last night:

1) I stole from a player, turned grey and permaflagged.

2) I went to my house, killed myself, ressed myself with another character to remove my permagrey status.

3) I waited until my grey flag disappeared and found the person I stole from earlier.

4) He attacked me and was not flagged (I was unable to call guards on him, for instance).

Some things to note:

I had not stole anything from anyone including the player after dying and resurrecting.

I did not commit any criminal acts (I highlighted as innocent).

I did not enter any houses after leaving my own.

The attack happened I would estimate between 30 seconds and 1 minute of me turning blue/highlighting innocent.

Something is screwy when it comes to stealing flagging and death, but I can't figure out what causes this. I have had it happen to me in the past a number of times. This situation occurs so frequently for me because one tactic I utilize is to steal, leave, die to drop my flag, and then bait someone to attack me in or near guards, to lure them to a swift and instant death

It catches me off guard every now and again when I drop my flag, return, get attacked and the guards do not come to help! Clearly I can't still be flagged for combat with the intended victim because I left and dropped my flag in my house, giving them no opportunity to continue attacking, and being away from the fight for greater than 2 minutes for the flag to wear off.