Being Red....

[RickyM]

I Remember when being red was the hard life... sure the rewards can be sweet.. but in general you did not see pk's EVERYWHERE.. just hanging out... chatting..

they were a bit scary yes.. but they also didn't want to just go in sight where people would show up and gank them..

also people weren't so easily to get away just because they had a mount.. what is that about??? sorry to change the subject.

few pks on a server were legends.. and people just hated them... seems like everyone has a red on the server to easy switch to and kill someone they dont know.

if a red dies on here he loses alittle stats ... now that might be era correct.. but the fact that DOES not effect the red is not era correct.. the fact its super easy to just macro those stats back is not era correct..

the ability to just use razor has broken the system you tried to rebuild it has screwed the era accuracy...

so you need to make so adjustments to counter act those breaks. I suggest giving the reds a stackable skill debuff.. not a skill lose but a debuff.. that last 12 hours of online game time.. and has a 5% skill lose for each count, the timer will refresh if the player dies again before the original debuff has worn off.. adding another count, in turn adding another 5%.. this might not be era accurate.. but this will give the reds a reason to not want to die.. instead of a small stat lose that takes some macroing while they sleep to remove.

most will cry and scream its not era accurate.. but neither is all the 7x gm chars running around that got there macroing for days at a time..

we aren't in 99 anymore.. the game play is the very much the same as far as everything goes.. but yet its soooo much different.. due to the fact there is no real punishments on this server... on real lose.. I could honestly say the only people on here that might feel a hard lose is the newbs to the server..

[corruption42]

I Remember when being red was the hard life... sure the rewards can be sweet.. but in general you did not see pk's EVERYWHERE.. just hanging out... chatting..

they were a bit scary yes.. but they also didn't want to just go in sight where people would show up and gank them..

also people weren't so easily to get away just because they had a mount.. what is that about??? sorry to change the subject.

few pks on a server were legends.. and people just hated them... seems like everyone has a red on the server to easy switch to and kill someone they dont know.

if a red dies on here he loses alittle stats ... now that might be era correct.. but the fact that DOES not effect the red is not era correct.. the fact its super easy to just macro those stats back is not era correct..

the ability to just use razor has broken the system you tried to rebuild it has screwed the era accuracy...

so you need to make so adjustments to counter act those breaks. I suggest giving the reds a stackable skill debuff.. not a skill lose but a debuff.. that last 12 hours of online game time.. and has a 5% skill lose for each count, the timer will refresh if the player dies again before the original debuff has worn off.. adding another count, in turn adding another 5%.. this might not be era accurate.. but this will give the reds a reason to not want to die.. instead of a small stat lose that takes some macroing while they sleep to remove.

most will cry and scream its not era accurate.. but neither is all the 7x gm chars running around that got there macroing for days at a time..

we aren't in 99 anymore.. the game play is the very much the same as far as everything goes.. but yet its soooo much different.. due to the fact there is no real punishments on this server... on real lose.. I could honestly say the only people on here that might feel a hard lose is the newbs to the server..

The mistake you are making is confusing social era accuracy with mechanical era accuracy. What you see is what likely would have become, had T2A lasted 5+ years in OSI -- it didn't, and major changes to the game altered what you saw. You can't expect the gameplay you experienced in '99, and thats simply not what this shard is about. Your suggestions ARE era inaccurate, because social policy is that of players. If players make the experience something thats different than you remember, its in your power to try to change it to something you do -- but its not something that the devs should, or will, spend any time on.

[RickyM]

"The mistake you are making is confusing social era accuracy with mechanical era accuracy. What you see is what likely would have become, had T2A lasted 5+ years in OSI"

I am sorry.. you said. what likely would have become?? likely... so that is indeed a guess.. Because we all know.. OSI would never have put up with all the unattended macro'ing.. and it would have NEVER been so easy to be RED... you can not keep "mechanics" frozen in time.. if the players are learning to abuse them.. a balance is missing.. I truly believe IF t2a lasted 5 years.. this for SURE would not be the outcome.. we would have the same feel, I love the carnage and chaos.. the trammel bullshit was the worse..

so what your saying is the ease of macro'ing is a social thing.. and that i should take this in my hands to fix.. maybe go around bashing the computers of said macroing to make it more era correct..

seems to me.. that anything can be easily put off, as that is "social policy"

do you think if there was a bug that was in the game to Duplicate items using the trade window.. in 99 that was patched in UO:R it should stay era accurate?.. i mean it could also be a social accuracy to take into play since only a few people might have none about it.. but now everyone on the server is duplicating gold and vanqs... so that should be fixed by the people??


just saying.. broken things should be fixed...

[corruption42]

"The mistake you are making is confusing social era accuracy with mechanical era accuracy. What you see is what likely would have become, had T2A lasted 5+ years in OSI"

I am sorry.. you said. what likely would have become?? likely... so that is indeed a guess.. Because we all know.. OSI would never have put up with all the unattended macro'ing.. and it would have NEVER been so easy to be RED... you can not keep "mechanics" frozen in time.. if the players are learning to abuse them.. a balance is missing.. I truly believe IF t2a lasted 5 years.. this for SURE would not be the outcome.. we would have the same feel, I love the carnage and chaos.. the trammel bullshit was the worse..

so what your saying is the ease of macro'ing is a social thing.. and that i should take this in my hands to fix.. maybe go around bashing the computers of said macroing to make it more era correct..

seems to me.. that anything can be easily put off, as that is "social policy"

do you think if there was a bug that was in the game to Duplicate items using the trade window.. in 99 that was patched in UO:R it should stay era accurate?.. i mean it could also be a social accuracy to take into play since only a few people might have none about it.. but now everyone on the server is duplicating gold and vanqs... so that should be fixed by the people??


just saying.. broken things should be fixed...

Yes, a guess. And anything you suggest is just a guess as well, so we have a difference of opinion. None of that matters though, because you're talking about aspects of the social game, not the game mechanics, that you PERCEIVE as broken. Your suggestions are to 'level the playing field' for blue chars, in your book. Thats not what this shard is about; and why anyone would come to a T2A shard seeking these kinds of changes is beyond me. Do you not realize that the very changes to advantage one group over another is what led to the game changing situation UO became and still is? You fix problem A for group 1, but it creates problem B for group 2 and invalidate an entire play style of group 3. Who is to determine who the right one is? You, because you feel slighted?

No, thats why social policy, as you're encouraging the dictation of, and changing of mechanics to allign with, is a bad idea. Thats why the shard's devs have taken a hard stance -- that of mechanical era accuracy -- because when you start trying to engineer the experience to tailor fit what any set group of players expects, someone else gets disappointed. With this design concept, you *KNOW* what you will get. It will not change; and if you have a problem with the way it is in game -- do something about it. Get together a group of angered blues, and police against some reds.

This shard needs more heroes, not more safe havens and rule changes.

[RickyM]

safe havens and shit??

sorry.. I want real villians.. not fuckin kids playing at villians.. I want all the lamers to actually suffer how WE did in those times.. if you were a RED you would understand what I am talking about..

IT should NOT be easy on a red.. a red should be SCARY to see.. and a red should get nervous when running into a place with a few blues.. the red is scary cause you know he kills people.. the blues are scary cause you dont want to have to sit around not doing shit for a day on that char to fix what you messed up dying..

they for sure not scared to lose a hand full of regs..

its not about making it easier for blues.. UO gave you a choice to do things right.. or choose a darker path.. but the darker path had its punishments.. I do not see any thing at all that scares a red on here.. oh i died.. ill get my stats back in 30 minutes.. thats not scary..

my suggestion is a temp debuff that wears off.. no macro'ing needed.. only sitting in game.. just like you would do if you want to go back blue..

or maybe the debuff could be multiplied 5% lose for every kill over +5 kills..


I remember losing skills on a red char of mine back in the day.. and it was not "debuff" so don't think I am asking for something to help blues.. I am simply trying to suggest something to BALANCE the system.. there was never more reds then blues.. and reds has something to fear. just like the blues.. so .. yeah..


stop your fuckin whining.. IF anything on this server is "carebear" it is the way the reds are treated..

[corruption42]

safe havens and shit??

sorry.. I want real villians.. not fuckin kids playing at villians.. I want all the lamers to actually suffer how WE did in those times.. if you were a RED you would understand what I am talking about..

IT should NOT be easy on a red.. a red should be SCARY to see.. and a red should get nervous when running into a place with a few blues.. the red is scary cause you know he kills people.. the blues are scary cause you dont want to have to sit around not doing shit for a day on that char to fix what you messed up dying..

they for sure not scared to lose a hand full of regs..

its not about making it easier for blues.. UO gave you a choice to do things right.. or choose a darker path.. but the darker path had its punishments.. I do not see any thing at all that scares a red on here.. oh i died.. ill get my stats back in 30 minutes.. thats not scary..

my suggestion is a temp debuff that wears off.. no macro'ing needed.. only sitting in game.. just like you would do if you want to go back blue..

or maybe the debuff could be multiplied 5% lose for every kill over +5 kills..


I remember losing skills on a red char of mine back in the day.. and it was not "debuff" so don't think I am asking for something to help blues.. I am simply trying to suggest something to BALANCE the system.. there was never more reds then blues.. and reds has something to fear. just like the blues.. so .. yeah..


stop your fuckin whining.. IF anything on this server is "carebear" it is the way the reds are treated..

I'm not the one thats whining about accurate mechanics, because I don't like them. We're done here, have a good day!

[RickyM]

like the recent article Derrek pointed out its a world they created..


yes the players should handle most things..

but your suggestion is "do something about it. Get together a group of angered blues, and police against some reds."

policing reds do nothing.. when they die they lose nothing.. so how does that handle it..

you think in a society, Murderer is promoted?

I was pked several times the first day.. with the red stating for me to add a 2k bounty and he will res me and give me my things.. why does he want a bounty? so his blue can kill him and turn in the head.. cause he LOSES nothing when he dies..

killing reds is like fighting a liche lord that has the loot of a zombie.. they carry shit.. and they are not effected on death...

but yes this conversion is over.. cause your points are all flawed as hell

[Freight Elevator]

lol conversion

Reds want a bounty as a status symbol. So their name shows up on the bounty boards.

[Lambo]

like the recent article Derrek pointed out its a world they created..


yes the players should handle most things..

but your suggestion is "do something about it. Get together a group of angered blues, and police against some reds."

policing reds do nothing.. when they die they lose nothing.. so how does that handle it..

you think in a society, Murderer is promoted?

I was pked several times the first day.. with the red stating for me to add a 2k bounty and he will res me and give me my things.. why does he want a bounty? so his blue can kill him and turn in the head.. cause he LOSES nothing when he dies..

killing reds is like fighting a liche lord that has the loot of a zombie.. they carry shit.. and they are not effected on death...

but yes this conversion is over.. cause your points are all flawed as hell

I along with you feel SOME of the red population on this server is distasteful and harmful to the well being of the server. However a lot of reds whom play here are in deep stat when they kill you and stock incredibly nice.

Last time I died on a red I was easily carrying upwards of 220k worth of gear. The pks 90% of the time have more to lose.

[krewlbr]

like the recent article Derrek pointed out its a world they created..


yes the players should handle most things..

but your suggestion is "do something about it. Get together a group of angered blues, and police against some reds."

policing reds do nothing.. when they die they lose nothing.. so how does that handle it..

you think in a society, Murderer is promoted?

I was pked several times the first day.. with the red stating for me to add a 2k bounty and he will res me and give me my things.. why does he want a bounty? so his blue can kill him and turn in the head.. cause he LOSES nothing when he dies..

killing reds is like fighting a liche lord that has the loot of a zombie.. they carry shit.. and they are not effected on death...

but yes this conversion is over.. cause your points are all flawed as hell

I along with you feel SOME of the red population on this server is distasteful and harmful to the well being of the server. However a lot of reds whom play here are in deep stat when they kill you and stock incredibly nice.

Last time I died on a red I was easily carrying upwards of 220k worth of gear. The pks 90% of the time have more to lose.

Who the hell carries 220k worth of gear around?? Wish they would die in front of me lol

[RickyM]

like the recent article Derrek pointed out its a world they created..


yes the players should handle most things..

but your suggestion is "do something about it. Get together a group of angered blues, and police against some reds."

policing reds do nothing.. when they die they lose nothing.. so how does that handle it..

you think in a society, Murderer is promoted?

I was pked several times the first day.. with the red stating for me to add a 2k bounty and he will res me and give me my things.. why does he want a bounty? so his blue can kill him and turn in the head.. cause he LOSES nothing when he dies..

killing reds is like fighting a liche lord that has the loot of a zombie.. they carry shit.. and they are not effected on death...

but yes this conversion is over.. cause your points are all flawed as hell

I along with you feel SOME of the red population on this server is distasteful and harmful to the well being of the server. However a lot of reds whom play here are in deep stat when they kill you and stock incredibly nice.

Last time I died on a red I was easily carrying upwards of 220k worth of gear. The pks 90% of the time have more to lose.

your saying the pks have more to lose cause they killed guys like you and wear your gear?

[Ohm]

There is definitely a downside to dying in statloss
It's not just a loss in stats.

If you rez in statloss you lose 20% of all skills and stats.
Takes 3-4 full days of macroing and costs about 150k + whatever you were carrying when you died (~100-200k)

[Grifty McGrift]

This game, and this server, provides a lot more punishment for player killing than any other game i've played. Take Darkfall for example. You can PK, and even become a RED murderer, but there are no penalties for doing so. The penalities we have, although you believe they are insignificant, make an individual think twice before deciding to openly attack another player. This has a direct social impact on how players play the game for the many reasons other player killers have listed. It is an important part of the idea behind player killers. There is no hope to having the moderators change the system. It is era accurate and is here to stay.

[[Uhh] Eo]

I was pked several times the first day.. with the red stating for me to add a 2k bounty and he will res me and give me my things..

Owned 1v1.

[Menkaure]

To make this shard absolutely perfect, take out Razor. Take out macroing. Too many people macro, its become a problem. Reg gathering, resource gathering (people do it, and just dont get caught), macroing hours of the red, macroing every skill known to man, etc;
It kills the game. I love this shard, but they may as well change the shard name to Ultima Online: Macroing Age.
Even if we could play a Razor free UO, and continue to allow macroing, that would be fine too. But I do see certain points of the OP.