Re: Fix LOS bug
Posted: Tue Jan 19, 2016 2:38 am
+1
A forum for discussion of Second Age UO Shard
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Mens Rea wrote:Great, now that you've wiped the reminants of Vega from your lips and chin, we can get back to discussing a return to a shard that acurately reflects the UO T2A that we knew and loved.
And, God forbid, in the process we get some people back to the shard.
BTW, Earth's 'Superest'-Genius-Ever, the word is, "remnants": were it anyone other than you, I'd be amazed that it hadn't been caught by the auto-editor (of course it was); you are one of those rare individuals who aptly demonstrates that anything that should 'run on rails' can be run off the rails, simply because the immense depths of of-all-possible-idiocy cannot be predicted.SighelmofWyrmgard wrote:Personally, I am glad that the Administration does not cater to the whines of douchebag sucks.
Your post proves my point - IN ERA - which staff "claim" to wantto emulate 100% - you could do the above - WORRY FREE. On this shard, with current mechanics, you can't. Thus - NOT ERA ACCURATE.SighelmofWyrmgard wrote:Finally, I'll say something:
So, Administration, "fix" the LOS bug, or else Blue-PKs will not be able to "safely" idle-off murder counts, and Stat-PKs will not be able to "safely" macro back their losses: the "deaths" of the Murderers is the death of the shard!
I'm pretty sure it was Vega, earlier in this thread, who advised, "grow a pair": I agree; after a pair has been grown, grow up.
Personally, I am glad that the Administration does not cater to the whines of douchebag sucks.
SS
Unless your point is to disallow Razor, I'm not: the above is a "get rid of Razor" argument; not a "fix the LOS bug" argument.Brules wrote:Modern day programs (Razer) allow you to take advantage of the code that is in place to do things you couldn't do in era.
Thus it needs to be fixed to be era accurate. Thanks for helping me make my point.
John Donne wrote: No man is an island,
Entire of itself,
Every man is a piece of the continent,
A part of the main.
If a clod be washed away by the sea,
Europe is the less.
As well as if a promontory were.
As well as if a manor of thy friend's
Or of thine own were:
Any man's death diminishes me,
Because I am involved in mankind,
And therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls;
It tolls for thee.
This is one of the responses that I suspect is directly aimed at me, so I'll respond to this.dren wrote:Now not to say, staff does not care about the community at all. Some staff regularly does turn a deaf ear toward players. There is always members of community that are roadblocks to progress. These individuals regularly refuse to consider the community's concerns, choose to regularly take on the mantle of the adversary with others, and make excuses rather than promoting creativity.
A minor change in deference would create more opportunities for staff and players to have their cake and eat it too.
I think that this particular paragraph is a good example of what I'm talking about above, particularly the italicized part (I also didn't tailor my response with this in mind; this isn't the first time that I've pointed these things out).dren wrote:This line of sight bug is just another example of that fact, which is evidenced by a simple review of this or other threads where large amounts of the community are requesting a thing that is not considered and/or immediately shot down. The tact in this area is seriously lacking. Staff could at least consider many things they don't agree with, or have already made a decision on. The fact is they may be wrong, it should stay on the table and they should seek out additional information and feedback. Willingness to make reversing decisions and/or new patches ought to be the norm, and not just a single instance here or there in a swath of hard stances and philosophies which last years before being changed -- often only after a great loss such as new staff coming in to replace the old staff.
There's a lot here, but I'm mostly going to be addressing the bolded parts.]dren wrote:Staff has been focused for years on patching in game breaking, quality degrading, era inaccurate ideas that are clearly not strongly backed up by patch notes or player experiences. Each time this happens we lose players. This is because of the staff and community attitude before and after the patch, as well as the unwillingness to change. We gain some back with some more hard work by staff and the community, and then another patch comes the same poor attitudes present themselves again and we lose more players. I'm sorry in the case this seems harsh, but let's be realistic. We all know very well that katana was not the fastest weapon, tamers had a different experience in OSI, stables here aren't within an every day T2A experience even though they may be "era accurate", auto events didn't exist but there was a ton of GM, Seer events, and there were Counselors. Era inaccurate bugs exist here and are not fixed, while "era accurate" bugs are patched in which are simply exploits or game breaking they were never intended or experienced in T2A. This is not the only one, it's going to happen. Clearly documented OSI rules are not enforced which would be applicable on UOSA or were enforced in the past -- players are allowed to exploit the game freely in ways that were not possible or even not allowed on UOSA/OSI at some points in era. Add ons are not given out or managed in any kind of system that is documented, consistent or fair for the community. The add on "GM Blessing" situation here is so very very far from era accurate. There are glacial staves, neon sandals. This server is not era accurate. It will NEVER be era accurate.
I agree, which is why we aren't attempting to achieve era accuracy in the sense of "the experience" because that varied from person to person. Mechanical accuracy is our main goal, and while it is also likely achievable, it is a discrete and objective task that can approach completion, whereas "the experience" has no such standard.dren wrote:Let's be honest with eachother: ERA ACCURACY IS A NON-ENTITY, AN UNATTAINABLE FICTION MADE UP IN THE MIND.
I'm not going to assume that this is directed at me, but this is a pretty significant claim to lay out against any staff member. If you have evidence of this being done, I would like to see it (PM is fine).dren wrote:UOSA Is still the best most era accurate UO server out there and likely always will be... However, select staff has always conveniently ignored their own hubris, attacked and lashed out, and even punished the community (sometimes severely) for speaking out on a regular basis through the years -- they've dished out more than their own fair share of crap as well.
I think that this is an important point, but the entire reason that LoS still behaves this way is due to the fact that our best information shows that the LoS code worked this way starting as early as late 1997, and continued to operate the exact same way up to a year ago (and probably still today).Onslaught- wrote:The LOS bug is fucking stupid. The fact that it existed in the first place was an error, a mistake, on OSI's part and it was fixed immediately. To keep it on server for the sake of accuracy is ridiculous. Nobody is reflecting on their time on OSI servers talking about how great the LOS bug was and how much fun they had with the LOS bug.
Its been in-game for far too long and it does nothing but add negativity to the experiences on UOSA.
It depends on what you mean by era accurate. The only concern for the server is mechanical accuracy, and the existence of a 1x1 tile in the ocean doesn't change the behavior of land or ocean in any meaningful way from that perspective.GleepGlop wrote:I have a fun question for the admins - would the addition of a single 1x1 plot of land in the middle of the ocean in T2A be considered not era accurate despite changing no mechanics?
IIRC the siege of trinsic banner is part of the client map file and isn't something that we can just get rid of.GleepGlop wrote:If it's not era accurate than I'd say everything on this server that essentially changes no mechanics but is an addition, is not era accurate and should be removed immediately. And get rid of that "seige of trinsic" banner in Trinsic, that technically hasn't happened yet and doesn't belong in this era get it out of here.
It's a lot more complicated than simply if adding x doesn't change the mechanics, then y amount is obviously acceptable.GleepGlop wrote:If it has jack to do with era accuracy what is the hold back to adding a new 1000x1000 dungeon containing monsters involved in events? Or really anything else that follows the spirit of the era (is that not the point of the server?) yet actually adds something.