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 Post subject: Guide: Alchemy
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2008 10:57 pm 
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According to Stratics from Oct. 12, 1999 (http://web.archive.org/web/199910140203 ... m/alchemy/) below is the regs and skills required for alchemy. I sorted by order of skill required, as it was in more of a grouped ordering by potion type.

Name...........Color...Reagent..........Effect...........Min.Skill
Cure (L).......Orange..1 Garlic.........Cures LP..........0
Heal (L).......Yellow..1 Ginsing........3-10 Healing......0
Nightsight.....Black...1 Spider's Silk..light until dawn..0
Poison (L).....Green...1 Nightshade.....(1-2%)hp/5 sec....0
Explosion (L)..Purple..3 Ash............1-5 Damage........5.1
Agility........Blue....1 Blood Moss.....Max STAM +10......15.1
Heal...........Yellow..3 Ginsing........6-20 Healing......15.1
Poison.........Green...2 Nightshade.....(5-10%)hp/4 sec...15.1
Refresh........Red.....1 Black Pearl....+25% Stamina......15.1
Cure...........Orange..3 Garlic.........Cures LP & P......25.1
Refresh (T)....Red.....5 Black Pearl....FULL Stamina......25.1
Strength.......White...2 Mandrake Root..MAX Health +10....25.1
Agility (G)....Blue....3 Blood Moss.....Max STAM +20......35.1
Explosion......Purple..5 Ash............6-10 Damage.......35.1
Strength (G)...White...5 Mandrake Root..MAX Health +20....45.1
Heal (G).......Yellow..7 Ginsing........9-30 Healing......55.1
Poison (G).....Green...4 Nightshade.....(15-25%)hp/3 sec..55.1
Cure (G).......Orange..6 Garlic.........Cures all poison..65.1
Explosion (G)..Purple..10 Ash...........11-20 Damage......65.1
Poison (D).....Green...8 Nightshade.....(10-40%)hp/3 sec..90.1

What to make and when to make it.
I first started with an ample supply of potion kegs (having a carpenter/tinker certainly helps unless you plan to just buy a significant number of kegs and mortars). bottles, about 75 Kegs, about 200 Mortars, and regs, regs, and more regs.

I went off the assumption that the server is accurate to the skills required to make pots for the era, which I am confident are correct. I weighed in a couple of thoughts as I made them. I first bought the skill to 30'ish. I think it may have been closer to 32, but I am not sure and it is not the point. I had Two things in mind. Fastest and Cheapest. For example, Heal and Greater Poison take the same amount of skill, but significantly different reg usage. Go with the Greater Poison because it is cheaper as well as it will come in handy if you plan on creating a poisoner. Because it uses half the regs as Greater Cure, Push it until the gains start to noticably slow down. Then go Greater Cure. The amount of various strength Poison pots needed to GM Poisoning is high as well. Later G-Heals and cures can be made as needed. But since you will be burning serious amounts of regs to GM Alchemy, get your base for another skill while you are at it.

I didn't start documenting anything until I was at about 50 skill, so from 30-50, I am working off of memory but beleive I am accurate as far as the reg usage. And the cost at this stage is pretty inconsequential in the overall process.

From 0-32 Bought the skill about 1 gp per .1%
From 32-40.0 I made Poison. Reg use was about 900 Nightshade. (2,700 gp) 34 gp per .1%
From 40-52.0 Strength Potions. Regs Used was 3500 Mandrake Root. (10,500 gp) 131 gp per .1%
52.0 to 64.0 Explosion Potions. Regs Used was 8500 Sulphur Ashe. (25,500 gp) 212 gp per .1%
64.0 to 75.0 Greater Strength Potions. Regs Used was 8,000 Mandrake Root. (24,000 gp) 221 gp per .1%
75.0 to 87.0 Greater Poison Potions. Regs used was 12,000 Nightshade. (36,000 gp) 300gp per .1%
87.0 to 94.0 Greater Cure Potions Regs Used were 12,000 Garlic. (36,000 gp) 514gp per .1%
94.0 to 97.0 Deadly Poison. Regs used was 15,500 Nightshade, (46,500 gp) 1550gp per .1%
*** Was a test*** 97.0 to 98.2 Greater Heal. Regs used 6,500 Gensing (19,500) 1625 gp per .1%
***Was a test*** 98.2 to GM Greater Poison. Regs Used 5,000 Nightshade (15,000 gp) 833 gp per .1%

Total Gold spent was approximately 220,000. My gains came to a very slow point from 93 to 94. I made the choice to go to DP here (for a short run). I was able to get 190 DP out of 15,500 Nightshade, so rougly 81 Nightshade per potion and 3.2 skill point gains (at 94 skill, I had 93.7 real skill and at 97.0 I have 96.9 real skill) so roughly 500 Nightshade per percentage point of skill gain. I ran a couple of small tests at the end as indicated above.

After a couple of tests, I conclude that the way I did it above was timewise faster, but it would have been considerably cheaper to go:
32-60 Poison
60-GM Greater Poison In the mid90's on up, the gains were very slow, but a significant less reg usage made this less expensive.

I again am confident the way indicated above is faster, but more expensive. Either way, my castle is swimming with kegs of potions, so a lot of room is needed as well. In the mid90's on up, the gains were very slow, but a significant less reg usage made this less expensive. Either way, figure on spending a minimum of 150K (cheap way) to 225k (fast way) to acheive GM alchemist.

I had 6 mortars in my bag, and 100 bottles. When I ran out of bottles, I knew I had a full keg. I made a little macro to drag and drop to the keg when 100 pots were made. Simple macro that I won't explain here.

My Alchemy Razor macro was as follows (not saying it's the best, just the one I used):
Double Click (target mortar)
Wait for Target
Absolute Target (Reg)
Wait for menu
Menu response
Pause 1.5 sec.
***Repeat this for each mortar in this macro***

With the 8 second delay per mortar, collectively I had 9 seconds of pauses, So when the macro started back at the top, the first mortar had been emptied of the regs it was grinding and so on. The timing was just right. For the reg, target by type did not seem to work, maybe someone could figure that out. Also I used the specific mortar (again not by type) and as they wore out I replaced it and retargeted the mortar I replaced with the new one and kept going. With this macro, I have got here in 3 evenings.


Last edited by Maleficia on Sun Aug 24, 2008 8:51 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Alchemy
PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 10:14 am 
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I was under the impression you can get from 0-100 from poison potions.. I'm currently working my alchemist as well and only using nightshade, haven't stopped gaining..

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 Post subject: Re: Alchemy
PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 6:21 pm 
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alatar wrote:
I was under the impression you can get from 0-100 from poison potions.. I'm currently working my alchemist as well and only using nightshade, haven't stopped gaining..


If that will run you all the way up that would be awesome (not for me now hehe). I didn't switch pots because my gains stopped, only because I was working off of the memory of about when I had to switch back in actual T2A. My gains were really fast with this method, so if what you say can run up to GM, it would certainly be a hell of a lot cheaper than what I did.


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 Post subject: Re: Alchemy
PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 6:31 pm 
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So far:

  • 0-30 (store bought)
  • 30-64.1 (regular poison)

After that teh gains stopped on normal poison. I had to switch over to greater poison from that point. I'll update further when I have time to continue macroing..

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 Post subject: Re: Guide: Alchemy
PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 7:28 pm 
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I did a small test with Greater Heals to see at 97.0 how they would do. I also broke out above my cost per gains at the stages. In the test I spent over 1600 gold per .1 gain on G-Heals. With DP, 1550.

Fuzzy Math Time, With 6500 Gensing, I had 928 attempts. If these were G-Poisons, 928 attempts would have taken 3,712 NS. I am going to make an assumption my gains would have been consistent (skill is the same on both). I also had plenty of Gensing, and out of NS, so I did this for the test. If these were GP's, it would have cost me 11,136 or 928gp (309 NS per .1%) per .1%. It appears as far as economies go, GP would cost 60% what DP would at these levels.


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 Post subject: Re: Guide: Alchemy
PostPosted: Sun Aug 24, 2008 8:36 pm 
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GM Alchemist is accomplished. I went from 98.2 to GM on G-Poison. It took about 5,000 NS. Soooo... I will editt above with the costs etc, but it cost roughly 833 gp per .1%. and I was able to get just under 6 kegs of G-poison potion. I will also make a note above agreeing with what you said Alatar as this, by my little test, appears to be the most economical way to go (G-Poisons that is).


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 Post subject: Re: Guide: Alchemy
PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 10:36 am 
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(3:30:42 PM) jjd: can you explain to me how potions are improved by the alchemist that is making them; also, how potions of differing quality behave when they are placed in the same keg
(3:31:06 PM) jjd: i.e. can a GH potion from a GM alchemist be better than one from a less skilled alchemist
(3:31:30 PM) jjd: and what would happen in a keg half filled with GM-made GH pots, and topped up with GH from a lesser alchemist
(3:31:52 PM) Derrick: They are all exactly the same :/
(3:32:10 PM) jjd: ok. there was a short debate about whether GM-made GH pots were better
(3:32:14 PM) jjd: and I didn't think that was the case
(3:32:23 PM) Derrick: This is OSI too. No, there never was a difference
(3:32:35 PM) jjd: that's great
(3:32:43 PM) jjd: so as long as I can make them, all potions are the same
(3:32:53 PM) Derrick: aye
(3:32:58 PM) jjd: and I will be best served just grinding out the pots and getting to GM "naturally"
(3:33:47 PM) Derrick: Yes, definately


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 Post subject: Re: Guide: Alchemy
PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 1:39 pm 
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Thanks for the info. I've only been making poison pots atm. I'm doing GP right now and will be doing deadly at some point. Using it all for a poisoner so it should be worth the expense regardless.


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 Post subject: Re: Guide: Alchemy
PostPosted: Tue Jan 05, 2010 1:25 am 
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You can simply target the mortar when asked to target the reg & it will automatically remake the same potion again (no need for menu).
This works for most all crafting skills. Target the crafting tool when asked to target the materials & it will remake the last item that individual tool made.


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 Post subject: Re: Guide: Alchemy
PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2010 2:35 pm 
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Looking for any updated information on making an Alchemist.....

Really looking for a total number of nightshade needed to go from 50 to GM. I have 30k, trying to estimate how much more I need.

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 Post subject: Re: Guide: Alchemy
PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2010 3:54 pm 
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Brules wrote:
Looking for any updated information on making an Alchemist.....

Really looking for a total number of nightshade needed to go from 50 to GM. I have 30k, trying to estimate how much more I need.


130-150k in gold

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 Post subject: Re: Guide: Alchemy
PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2010 9:52 pm 
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This is what i did somewhere around a month ago. The first skill is alchemy, the second poisoning.

53.0/57.9 Regular (1916 shade)
61.0/68.0 Greater (33896 shade)
100.0/96.7 Greater (37684 shade)

So 35812 nightshade (107436gp) to GM Alchemy and an additional 37684 nightshade (113052gp) to finish Poisoning. A total of 73496 nightshade (220488gp) for both.

I'd strongly suggest when alchemy stops gaining with regular poison to switch to greater strength for a couple kegs (much, much better at 68-72). I burned through a lot of greater poisons unnecessarily.


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 Post subject: Re: Guide: Alchemy
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 7:13 pm 
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New updates 2012??

Thanks


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 Post subject: Re: Guide: Alchemy
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2012 10:06 am 
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Any Updates to this?
I'm looking to a good way to macro this :(

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 Post subject: Re: Guide: Alchemy
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2012 4:00 pm 
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I just made poison pots. I started with 50 alch/50 poisoning. Made regular poison to like 70ish
then on to greater till 85-90, then deadly. At 1st I did alch/poisoning at the same time, but it was
to slow. I saved all my poison kegs [lesser str one] to train poisoning.

As my skill gained, I would make greater kegs ie: heal/cure/str/dex/explo for personal use, which
yielded some gains.

The chart above will get you real close to the amount of shade you will need to GM both skills.

Hope this helps!

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