Party System

[Flash Hardstar]

Well Faust, I can tell you I have ventrillo on my computer because I have other mmo's but I do not use it with UO. If guild chat and party chat were gone, I would most likely start using it, hence the perfect example that people who have access to it dont always use it, and others would catch on...if they haven't already. Anywho, the system is doing no more harm than it is good ~ IMO, neutral.

[kill drizitz]

patch notes should not be pick and choose like they have been. if your going to impliment some of the more rough patches, (5 item sold max) then the ones that dont make a "huge" difference shouldnt be left out. party/guild chat were out of ear, clear as day.

[Faust]

The "5 item" limit isn't a pick or choose out of the era. That limit lasted way past UOR and changed sometime during that era.

[Derrick]

Again as a reminder, this wasn't done nearly as much for accuracy as necessity due to technical limitations of the sell menu and to fix the sliding price scale which was completely broken as mentioned in other threads on the subject.

Getting off topic fast here. I'd like to hear more about the party system and the guild chat. Vendor sell limits are completely unrelated to this topic.

The reason we are discussing, and not just ripping it out of the system is because while we work towards era accuracy we to prioritize. This is not a large concern for me on the list of work that needs to be done. If it becomes clear that it's a large concern to the players I will gladly re-prioritize.

[Arcanus]

Ok, so you get rid of party system. then we will all have to use UOAM icq, all the garbage i dont want on my computer! And I wouldn't say it would give more skill at all because people will just download ventrillo and need even less skill =/

If someone is in a situation where they can use vent they will use it regardless. The arguement for skill is most certainly valid. Party system allows health bars to stay up indefinitely. However, in the opposite scenario they disappear if your "team member" runs off the screen. It takes a somewhat skillful approach to keep these bars up or bring them back up if they have removed. This also slightly renders the annoying people that love to run off screens in group fights.

What client version are you using? I think around the 5.x clients, they introduced the feature known as "sticky bars", where normal health bars do not disappear when the target hides or goes off-screen; they simply become “grayed out”. They do disappear when the target dies on-screen, however.

I think this feature has a bigger impact on the "skill factor" than anything else, and it is a function of the client, not a server setting. There'd have to be a client version restriction put in place to enforce the non-use of this feature, which sounds like a huge headache for the player base.

With that said, getting rid of the party system will effectively only remove mana/stamina indicators. People will still use Ventrilo and UOAM for communication and positioning.

I know the standard is to take a hard-line approach to era accuracy, but I feel the utility gained from this feature makes the game better for its players without compromising the mechanics. PvMers, role players, and PvPers alike use the party system.

There’s only so much one can do to re-create an old school environment; what can’t be changed are people’s attitudes and experience, and the use of different third party programs. Voice communication and “global positioning” programs are the status quo for online gaming now. Turning off the party system will present only an inconvenience for those who will find a work-around.

[Faust]

I had no idea that a new version of the client had that feature. I've always took a negative approach to updating my client. Some of the screenshots that I've seen only makes me think more and more of AoS with the future client changes. One particular feature that I dislike is that little odd looking thing that is above a targets head and below their feet. I'm still not sure what the hell that is... I am only assuming it's who you have in combat at the moment.

I just recently updated my client to a 5.0.0 version, because of the events. However, I still was not able to go into one so I probably need the final one that is required on the server to participate in it. It hasn't been a high priority on my end so I've still actually have not done it.

Voice programs for me has been around since '98. It first started with Roger Wilco. It is nothing new to me really. A wide spread use of them wasn't as frequent as it is now of course.

The party system is not that big of a concern to me anymore since an updated client has the same static bar feature. The party system doesn't play as much of a factor in a skillful environment as I previously had thought. I no longer have an objection to it besides the arguement that it isn't era accurate. However, in all honesty, I could really care less if it stays here now.

[kill drizitz]

The "5 item" limit isn't a pick or choose out of the era. That limit lasted way past UOR and changed sometime during that era.

its exacally what it is, pick or choose. party system was clearly not in during era. guild chat YOU posted came in during 2005 (6 years after era). so why is it even a question? your 5 item limit i am not complaining about just to be clear. its just odd to me that while you "choose" to put it in because its clearly in era, why would you "choose" not to put this in. i just hate seeing the shard patch some of the t2a era patches, but not all. if your willing to slow the economy this drastically, then why arent you willing to get rid of a simple party/guild chat.

we have been going back and forth on many era related issues for a while now on this shard, without definate proof one way or the other. when something comes up WITH definate proof, i dont see how it wouldnt be top priority to impliment. everything on the stratics patch notes from before 2000, should be looked at, and implimented if possible.... everything.

EDIT: Derrick, if we are discussing the party system, before you think about disabeling it, why didnt we get to do the same for the 5 item limit rule? i think people want the party system, and dont want 5 item limit. do we delete 5 item limit and keep party system? seems kinda like a pick and choose thing to me.

[Faust]

Again as a reminder, this wasn't done nearly as much for accuracy as necessity due to technical limitations of the sell menu and to fix the sliding price scale which was completely broken as mentioned in other threads on the subject.

Getting off topic fast here. I'd like to hear more about the party system and the guild chat. Vendor sell limits are completely unrelated to this topic.

The reason we are discussing, and not just ripping it out of the system is because while we work towards era accuracy we to prioritize. This is not a large concern for me on the list of work that needs to be done. If it becomes clear that it's a large concern to the players I will gladly re-prioritize.

For the accurate selling system based on scaling prices to work, the 5 item limit that existed during that era had to also be implemented. We did not simply choose to add the 5 item limit because it was era accurate. We chose to add the authentic vendor sell system that required the 5 item limit to also be added. This has been stated multiple times can we please stay on topic now.

[platy]

Driz was using 5 limit selling as an example: hardly off topic unless your not understanding what he's saying (which obviously Derrick and Faust don't get).
Apparently UOSA isn't immune to OSI's original problems... Too many patches which continuously lower the appeal of the game/gameplay.
I love t2a style shards and i love UOSA but i'm with driz: either take everything from t2a or not! This isn't one of those: "lets see who remembers party systems" and I think having a poll to see if ppl want party system is the equivalent to having a poll: "should we be able to heal through poison"
i mean there was a time when any accuracy discrepency = high priority change.
...not anymore...

[Faust]

Personally, I would remove anything after UOR, but that is my opinion.

[Derrick]

What I said above and what few seemed to read before adding the posts that followed is that I have a lot of high priority changes, and also that the item limit was not primarily changed for accuracy as has been stated may many times here and elsewhere. While it is accurate, the change was made to fix a problem.

[platy]

This has been stated multiple times can we please stay on topic now.

Getting off topic fast here. I'd like to hear more about the party system and the guild chat. Vendor sell limits are completely unrelated to this topic.

The "5 item" limit isn't a pick or choose out of the era. That limit lasted way past UOR and changed sometime during that era.

I think we get it guys, your ignoring our statements that you aren't being "consistent" in your patches and what not.. I understand you have your priorities as well, but sooner or later the only word I can use to describe the ideas being implemented is "rediculous"
It somewhat goes back to another post by someone (maybe Arcanus I cant remember).. while accuracy is important (not so much these days it seems), so should be common sense (also less so these days)..

I'm sorry for coming off like a dick and don't want to start a forum war between the GM's and Mods but whatever: if i'm the only one expressing my dislike for the direction of the shard so be it: i'll be unhappy alone..

[Faust]

Derrick and I both are working on high priority issues that are of far more importance than the 5 item limit. The only reason the 5 item limit even came about is because Derrick is working on the NPC Vendor files at this very moment. He is working with a significant amount of different factors involved with it. It isn't like he simply said "oh hey, let's add the 5 item limit" out of no where... This thread is suppose to be about the party, guild, chat, etc.. type of systems. All we want is to have a healthy productive discussion in here about it.

I think we get it guys, your ignoring our statements that you aren't being "consistent" in your patches and what not..

Platy, I hold accuracy to a degree far more above than probably anyone on this shard. However, when it comes down to the priority list ALL issues will be dealt with throughouly. I guarentee you that. I don't think people understand the scope of what is still left to be done or fixed...

What have we not been consistent with in our patches? I don't quite understand what you mean by that. This probably should be discussed in another thread though...

[kill drizitz]

find the notes that you can, impliment the change, and leave it alone. and i do understand that this is NOT top priority to get implimented if at all. but i have brought several points now that are all related to t2a era acuracies which have gone unoticed/unchanged. the poisoning thing i brought up like 3-4 months ago and nothing has been done. everything seems to be pick/choose or priority/not priority.

ps, u could have fixed your problem in another way, but chose the era acurate way. stop acting like the only reason for the 5 item limit is to fix a problem. like i said, pick and choose.

[Kharza]

Simple fix to this guys... post your priority list of fixes just like a software dev hit list.. let the community provide feedback on the priority and then implement. Not hard.. and you can do like we do in Software Dev.. decide whether you want to listen or not but at least we as the end users know what is coming and to expect.

Khar