Survival Game Cheaters

[Pirul]

To address Matron's and Blackfoot's concerns, I agree it is not the best way to police events, however staff is not always on when these events take place. There should be a better way of enforcing this, however, it is a staff implemented rule, and as such should be observed. Stumpy won many such events using footstools before the rule was in place, even I used them on ocasion. But since the rule has been in place honest players like Stumpy, Peppin, and many others have stopped using them.

What I meant when I said: remove the rule or remove the game, is in response to Nevermore's post in the discussion thread saying this was survival game, not trap monster with footstools game. So in short, yes, a change in mechanics would be needed to make sure this game is what admin wants it to be.

[Nevermore]

I'd just like to take this time to point out that all staff are volunteers with full time jobs and much much more to do. The initial thread and signs posted were a quick fix to try and deter people from continuing using foot stools until we had time to implement more effective fixes for the game itself. But I do thank all those who have been on the lookout for people using this tactic.

A fix to where it will be impossible for it to be abused will be issued as soon as possible, initially I never even considered the possibility of using foot stools to block monsters in the event. Thus no initial rule and nothing was scripted into it to prevent it. But as mentioned, as soon as possible it will be addressed more permanently and I encourage everyone to stay vigilant until that time comes.

Thank you.

[elhorno]

why did you call it survival game anyway? Provocation game may be even more suitable.

From Matrons "How to not die by properly preparing yourself" stickied survival guide :
6.) Tables or some other non-crossable object :
Why tables? Why not tables! Record a macro to drag these by type and drop them to your relative location (0,0). This has so many uses, I can only begin to explain a few. If you get into a long straight run (usually in the woods) and the bad guy is tossing potions or gaining on you, just start into a clear path, get him right behind you and deploy a table. This can get you valuable distance to recall/heal and confuse them. Another great use for this is coupled with local housing. Find a non-french door home or building, run in and deploy a table in the doorway, run around the corner and recall or heal. It's wise to keep the help-stuck gump open in case you get pinned inside, or to make a quick escape back outside. These are super-handy at the double balron room in t2a. My most prepared characters carry a wood box with 5-10 candlabras inside and an axe. The macro they use chops the box leaving the candlabras uniformly stacked and impassable. This is great for blocking people out of their homes (Joshua Lee) as well as many other uses.


Survival is survival is survival. I always saw this tactic as a creative thing, looking outside the box. Something we all encourage in Ultima. Regardless the staff and obviously even community disagreed and it was declared illegal. Problem is its very possible that some of the people who were event-banned and robbed ( they had their silver taken? ) may not have known the rule. I'm just saying, its a possibility, a big one i think, that of all the persons event banned, one legitimately didn't click the sign on the wall, but that's obviously speculation.
I just think its a bummer that the hammer was swung when ultima in this era, to me anyway, has always been largely about the creative thinking and the community enforcement. Those who attend the event regularly will attest to seeing stools vs stools vs stools in a single match. And in the end the player who survived the longest did so because of his manipulation of the monsters with provocation and his use of magery. And often footstools lost to non footstool provokers. Regardless they were used for months and months.
This has been going on for a long time and I just think it was a haste decision to what i see as rushing to fix the problem. I would just vie for skipping the small sign on the wall warning ---> event ban stage. Instead take the complaints about footstools, make the decision that you don't want them used in survival game as it was never intended that way, and in whatever time frame is convenient implement a fix.

[iamreallysquall]

why did you call it survival game anyway? Provocation game may be even more suitable.

From Matrons "How to not die by properly preparing yourself" stickied survival guide :
6.) Tables or some other non-crossable object :
Why tables? Why not tables! Record a macro to drag these by type and drop them to your relative location (0,0). This has so many uses, I can only begin to explain a few. If you get into a long straight run (usually in the woods) and the bad guy is tossing potions or gaining on you, just start into a clear path, get him right behind you and deploy a table. This can get you valuable distance to recall/heal and confuse them. Another great use for this is coupled with local housing. Find a non-french door home or building, run in and deploy a table in the doorway, run around the corner and recall or heal. It's wise to keep the help-stuck gump open in case you get pinned inside, or to make a quick escape back outside. These are super-handy at the double balron room in t2a. My most prepared characters carry a wood box with 5-10 candlabras inside and an axe. The macro they use chops the box leaving the candlabras uniformly stacked and impassable. This is great for blocking people out of their homes (Joshua Lee) as well as many other uses.


Survival is survival is survival. I always saw this tactic as a creative thing, looking outside the box. Something we all encourage in Ultima. Regardless the staff and obviously even community disagreed and it was declared illegal. Problem is its very possible that some of the people who were event-banned and robbed ( they had their silver taken? ) may not have known the rule. I'm just saying, its a possibility, a big one i think, that of all the persons event banned, one legitimately didn't click the sign on the wall, but that's obviously speculation.
I just think its a bummer that the hammer was swung when ultima in this era, to me anyway, has always been largely about the creative thinking and the community enforcement. Those who attend the event regularly will attest to seeing stools vs stools vs stools in a single match. And in the end the player who survived the longest did so because of his manipulation of the monsters with provocation and his use of magery. And often footstools lost to non footstool provokers. Regardless they were used for months and months.
This has been going on for a long time and I just think it was a haste decision to what i see as rushing to fix the problem. I would just vie for skipping the small sign on the wall warning ---> event ban stage. Instead take the complaints about footstools, make the decision that you don't want them used in survival game as it was never intended that way, and in whatever time frame is convenient implement a fix.

first table blocking or footstool blocking a player while running has nothing to do with the barding event i think the only time i ever seen a farmer use footstool is for lame dragon turrets which even after a patch making it slightly harder they found ways to do it i dont see bards blocking spawn with footstools in the open world =\ sorry fact is like nevermore said it's not how the game was intended to be played by finding a loophole and making surviving ultra easy via stools

[elhorno]

first table blocking or footstool blocking a player while running has nothing to do with the barding event i think the only time i ever seen a farmer use footstool is for lame dragon turrets which even after a patch making it slightly harder they found ways to do it i dont see bards blocking spawn with footstools in the open world =\ sorry fact is like nevermore said it's not how the game was intended to be played by finding a loophole and making surviving ultra easy via stools

That is legitimate, my point here could have nothing to do with it. I was more making a draw to survival. From the guide "This has so many uses, I can only begin to explain a few. " This again alluding to the creativity aspect in survival. And I make the connection because of the games name, survival game. If its a game meant to see who can survive the longest, and footstools work, a logical person who wants to win...etc.

But what about my idea about going from complaint to fix, in whatever time frame necessary, and skipping the small sign ban phase for a mechanic that has been used for months and months?
This ^ is really my main point.

[MatronDeWinter]

I don't think there should be anything illegal about doing it as long as it is a mechanic of the game.

[Sandro]

just have the script remove all stools every spawn, just like it does with the auto-reveal each turn

[Boondock_Saint]

just smelt the events and everyone's trammel gear masks/sandals etc. thanks!

[iamreallysquall]

just smelt the events and everyone's trammel gear masks/sandals etc. thanks!

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

[itwouldbewise]

Hey all,

I am one of the... *gasp*... "cheaters" who was caught (a big sTinker). I don't know about the others who were cheating, but this is my perspective on what has transpired:

I joined UOSA a bit over a month ago, and didn't get involved in the survival event until about 2 or 3 weeks ago. I actually fully agree that stools should not be used in the event, and when I saw it happening the first survival event I attended I thought that there was no way to compete with it, and so I started using them myself (I've used them for 2 or 3 games total out of the (I believe) 5 survival games I've participated in). From my point of view it made sense to use whatever you could to get an advantage (just like in PvP), and the only resistance I received to it from others was the occasional trash talker saying "stools users are %#^# lame"--but trash talk isn't new to me and I tend not to take it seriously. I don't recall anybody approaching me in-game and specifically saying "That can get you banned from this (or all) event" (not that I was expecting it since I had taken my queue from the many other stool users out there who seemed to be having no problems and have quite possibly been doing it far longer than me).

As to the new rule announcement that I happened to miss on this forum: I tend to rely on in-game interactions to get server news, and only occasionally check these forums (mostly to check out what events are going on)... not that it's a good habit to have or anything . Therefore, it is not surprising that I missed the announcement that stools would get me banned from all events. Of course, I understand that there MUST be some way of communicating new rules to everybody on the shard, and that users should be expected to abide by those rules. However, what happened to me reminds me of a friend of mine who got a $100 traffic ticket for a new traffic law that apparently was just passed and immediately and brutally enforced. When my friend told the policeman, "I had no idea that was a law", his reply was, "It's been on TV for the last 6 months." My friend barely watches TV (SHAME ON HIM, right?! yea, whatever). He told the officer that, but, of course, the officer still gave him the ticket (and was quite rude to him). Luckily for him, the judge was somewhat sympathetic and reduced the penalty.

I really enjoy CTF and the dueling events (far more than the survival event, although I do find those to be fun as well), so when I attempted to join one the other day and it said that I am "prohibited at this time" I was pretty confused. I thought maybe it would wear off (especially after returning from out-of-town these last few days), and when it didn't (as of this morning), I only then came to the forums and discovered the change that had been made about 10 days ago (even though my used of stools occurred ~5 days ago).

I can't speak for other former stool users out there, but I would DEFINITELY not have used them if I knew that this rule was in place. This post is partly a plea to the "judges" (server administrators)--not so much the policeman who sometimes appear to find delight in turning in the "criminals" regardless of their circumstances and without explaining to them what they did wrong (nice screenshot of me, by the way . I don't necessarily expect to be allowed to participate in the survival game anymore (not that I'd ever use stools again...), or even that my "sentence" is reduced (as I know it would probably be difficult to verify my situation and there may be others cheaters who would claim ignorance to the rule as I have--although I also doubt whether they were completely in the know either) but I would like to ask the administrators out there the following:
-Is it possible that the prohibition (at least in my case) be lifted--I promise I'll be good But seriously, if I had known the rule I wouldn't have done it in the first place.
-If not, then is it possible to just have me prohibited from the survival game and not the other events?
-If not, is it possible to have the prohibition wear off in a shorter amount of time (like a week?)
-If not, can I at least know how long I won't be able to participate in these events so I don't have to keep coming back to see that accursed "prohibited" message?
(and yes, I am a programmer if you couldn't tell by the if-else's.. hehe)

Thanks.
-a big stinker (don't let the name fool you, it's somewhat incriminating, but I'm really a good guy... heh)

[Fede]

I hope you get unbanned soon!

[Pirul]

I hear you sTinker, and I'm right there with Fede on this one.

However, after I took the first picture, I waited for you in the waiting area to finish the game to explain the new rule to you. When you finally where eliminated, I did say it was illegal, and that sanction for it was bannishment from events. Apparently you were too busy doing something else because you just sat there and gave me no response. I thought you were purposely ignoring me, and thus the rule. It was then I decided I should PM the pic to admin.

I hope to see you in Survival soon, and good luck.

[itwouldbewise]

Yea, I tend to go afk (or log off) on the bard as soon as I get eliminated ... It's a bummer that I missed the heads up from you.

[elhorno]

It's a quick fix until there's time to find a proper solution and code in it. And I'm not really too concerned with people who don't read the signs because it's fairly obvious that footstool blocking isn't okay.

Sorry to hear about your ban Stinker, and apparently it wasn't fairly obvious that footstools aren't allowed. On the contrary, when I first saw people using stools, and they continued to use them for months and months, it became fairly obvious that footstool blocking was ok. I'm glad i got lucky and saw the forum post!

[Braden]

This may seem snide, but how do you know those photographs were not photoshopped? If the the direction of staff involvement is tending towards policing published photos of other users, I could see that leading to trouble. Granted there are several forum members complaining of the matter, and acting as witnesses for the most part, what is to stop a group of knaves from doing the same?

Who is to say that tomorrow, Guardianknight, Darkwing, and Kelektra, don't band together and testify to a falsified photograph of Sandro using stools in the duel arena?

Why are you assuming that we have not witnessed it first hand? Can you see invisible staff members?