Multiclienting Compromise?

[zzyzx]

I'd love to know what the logic is behind this.

Era accuracy=no multiclienting? Then the guy with 3 computers has a huge advantage....totally dumb. Why claim era accuracy on something that simply involves having enough money to buy hardware? Scrap this reasoning please, it's crap.

Yes, scrap your reasoning. It IS crap. Would you be happy if we found the exact percentage of people who multi-cliented on OSI and enacted that here on a select few here? Maybe draw names out of a hat to see who gets the multiple accounts. Seems fair, no?

Is it "I don't like the fact that some people utilize 3 clients and beat UO while I don't have the time/inclination/brains to do it too?" Obviously, a specious argument....smelt it.

I am one of the multi-client centric people that is actually OPPOSED to having multiple clients. You assume too much.

If you want to macro hiding on two chars while you kill monsters, what is the the problem?

If you want to have three people interacting in a resist session simultaneously, what is the problem?

Way to list every GOOD thing you can do with three clients. Why not list some bad ones that many people abuse? Do you think if everyone on OSI had 3 accounts at their disposal UO would have seen some drastic changes to prevent the abuses that arise with rampant multi-clienting? I mean, heaven FORBID you have to depend on other players in an MMO. I am sure one of the reasons MMOs were created were to deter socialization amongst the players. Ever wonder why vendors SUCK here? Small Hint: IT'S BECAUSE EVERYBODY HAS A GM SMITH/ALCHY/TAILOR/CARPENTER/TINKER/INSCRIBER/MINER/LUMBERJACK.

If I had three computers and 3 dialup connections in 99 I could have done the same thing. I did have 2 of each, and my family played them both legally at the same time.

*facepalm* But you didn't. Stupid, stupid argument.

[Dagon]

Era accuracy=no multiclienting?

Yeah, basically.

You're confusing how things actually were with what the possibilities were.

Right now anyone running a 486DX 25Mhz can multi-client with 3 accounts. . that surely was not how it was in t2a, not just because of hardware limitations but because of the restrictions you yourself said further down:

If I had three computers and 3 dialup connections in 99 I could have done the same thing. I did have 2 of each, and my family played them both legally at the same time.

There's your era accuracy. Not many people would pay for a second or third phone line just to play UO with multiple clients on 28.8-56k lines. The guy playing with a 486DX now (felix? lol) and running 3 clients is nowhere near being accurate.

Face it, in t2a not many people played with more than 1 account.. even less played with 2, and i'd bet that only a small few played with 3.. sure, let's HAVE 3 accounts here, but doesn't mean you should be able to play them all simultaneously .

[Hemperor]

You've admitted on many multiple times to play with at least 3 clients at any given time, gate bot, tamer, plus an extra vet/healer for your farming purposes...

This is not illiegal and doesnt interfear with your game play. It is how I enjoy the game.

I think your friend can wait till he gets home to play,

Now that is just plain nonsense.

How does that not interfere with gameplay? For you to basically farm with AT LEAST 3 clients (that you admit to) is just absolutely insane. One for heals and one to gate you out when shit gets rough...the gater can obviously not be interrupted.

That affects gameplay, if everyone were to exploit the shard like you do there would be some major major flaws with the shard.

[Halogen]

Help me understand, why do we have three accounts?

Once again...to play them.

I did indeed play legally with two computers and two dialup accounts in '99.

To say that most people didn't do something ten years ago is meaningless as an argument against it.

The fact is it was possible and was done, and now, thanks to Derrick, we can do the same things we could do quite legally ten years ago without all the extra cost.

There is no logic to what you are saying about era accuracy...all these things could be done and were done, era accurately and legally according to OSI.

Bottom line, give it up, you're wrong.

[Hemperor]

Help me understand, why do we have three accounts?

Once again...to play them.

I did indeed play legally with two computers and two dialup accounts in '99.

To say that most people didn't do something ten years ago is meaningless as an argument against it.

The fact is it was possible and was done, and now, thanks to Derrick, we can do the same things we could do quite legally ten years ago without all the extra cost.

There is no logic to what you are saying about era accuracy...all these things could be done and were done, era accurately and legally according to OSI.

Bottom line, give it up, you're wrong.

And the obnoxious fear of the automated MMORPG players afraid of no longer being able to do 4 seperate templates at once with zero effort continues!
Clearly Derrick sees our argument, I believe in the past he has even stated accounts/client limits would be much lower if he could change the starting.

Let the players vote, although it should be noted that "1" isn't really an option...So 1 and 2 should combine.

[Duke Jones]

Help me understand, why do we have three accounts?

Once again...to play them.

Sort of....

If I recall correctly, Derrick originally intended for up to 3 players per household be allowed to play by allowing 3 accounts per IP. Inevitably, it turned into "Hey! Three accounts per Household... Let's abuse this privilege by using all 3 accounts per player!"

And as a result, this promotes the following:

-AFK resource gathering
-AFK Tourney Sitting
-AFK Skill macroing while playing on another account
-Ghosting (IDOCs/Risk-Free PvP surveillance)
-AFK waiting off Red Statloss (neutering the statloss system severely by allowing multiclienting to play another character.)

[Halogen]

I'm pretty sure that Derrick remembers that it was exactly...EXACTLY this sort of whining that led to the creation of Trammel and all the crap that came with it....and the subsequent massive drop in shard populations that, in addition to the other choices that came onto the scene like Everquest, led to the relegation of UO to the ranks of the online also-rans in a relatively short time. Those of us that lived it remember well the nightmarish horror of developers listening to every "balance" whine, every "unfair" whine, etc., and slowly destroying the game pixel by pixel.

Because he was there, Derrick knows that those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

Based on his track record (and his is the only vote that counts....a few dozen people from a skewed sample who by and large want to change everything aren't going to mean squat), I trust his judgement.

I'd actually love to see Derrick build a Trammel server as well, totally separate, only one account, with all the awesome changes you guys want to "balance things" and make them eminently "fair"....unfortunately I would also hate to see Derrick subjected to that kind of nonsense.

We'll stay here on the real server....enjoy!

[zzyzx]

Help me understand, why do we have three accounts?

Once again...to play them.

I did indeed play legally with two computers and two dialup accounts in '99.

Help me understand, why do we NEED to have three accounts logged in at the same time?

To say that most people didn't do something ten years ago is meaningless as an argument against it.

The fact is it was possible and was done, and now, thanks to Derrick, we can do the same things we could do quite legally ten years ago without all the extra cost.

Why stop at 3? Why not 15? Yes, FIFTEEN accounts for EVERYBODY!

There is no logic to what you are saying about era accuracy...all these things could be done and were done, era accurately and legally according to OSI.

There is no logic in what YOU are saying. Just because a very small percentage DID have the ability did not mean that everyone waltzed around with 3 accounts.

Bottom line, give it up, you're wrong.

You haven't even tried to refute any of my points made previously that were directed straight at you. Until you do so, I will assume that YOU are wrong.

[Hemperor]

I'm pretty sure that Derrick remembers that it was exactly...EXACTLY this sort of whining that led to the creation of Trammel and all the crap that came with it....and the subsequent massive drop in shard populations that, in addition to the other choices that came onto the scene like Everquest, led to the relegation of UO to the ranks of the online also-rans in a relatively short time. Those of us that lived it remember well the nightmarish horror of developers listening to every "balance" whine, every "unfair" whine, etc., and slowly destroying the game pixel by pixel.

Because he was there, Derrick knows that those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

Based on his track record (and his is the only vote that counts....a few dozen people from a skewed sample who by and large want to change everything aren't going to mean squat), I trust his judgement.

I'd actually love to see Derrick build a Trammel server as well, totally separate, only one account, with all the awesome changes you guys want to "balance things" and make them eminently "fair"....unfortunately I would also hate to see Derrick subjected to that kind of nonsense.

We'll stay here on the real server....enjoy!

You know for a fact that Derrick hasn't decided on the subject and has actually requested a poll.

You are basically threatening that this shard would be trammel if Derrick were to listen to legitimate topics like this.

Am I the only one noticing a common trend with the Automated UO players?

[Halogen]

Once again, Derrick's vote is the only one that counts.

Let's see what he decides.

[tekai]

Sort of....

If I recall correctly, Derrick originally intended for up to 3 players per household be allowed to play by allowing 3 accounts per IP. Inevitably, it turned into "Hey! Three accounts per Household... Let's abuse this privilege by using all 3 accounts per player!"

Duke that isnt true at all, he did it for the multi boxers, as derrick himself held multiple accounts between his family in era.

[Tron]

-AFK resource gathering
-AFK Tourney Sitting
-AFK Skill macroing while playing on another account
-Ghosting (IDOCs/Risk-Free PvP surveillance)
-AFK waiting off Red Statloss (neutering the statloss system severely by allowing multiclienting to play another character.)

1. Needs to be policed anyways.
2. Does not happen nearly often enough to be listed. (Ask Derrick if you don't believe me)
3. AFK skilling is era accurate.
3. Ghosting was era accurate, tho it is very abused here by some, it was era accurate.
5. Also era accurate, tho probably not done as much there as here, but pks will still be here, regardless of this.

Bottom line tho, and Luca said it of all people, that this is era accurate.

With as many changes as we have to swallow on the premise of era accuracy, (to our pvp system for example) I don't think an exception should be made for this, unless we want to open the floodgate on all things. I don't like the era accuracy policy, but I've been forced to stomach it, that's the way it is here. Now I back most changes that put us on that track because that's where the shard is going no matter what. This is not one of those changes. Multi-clienting is 100% era accurate.

[Hemperor]

Technically it would be era accurate to have an infinite amount of clients connect at one time using that ideology...

But that would just be ridiculous, hopefully you can reach that thought process otherwise the true goal of this shard is just lost to you.

2 is more than enough.

[Tron]

I think 2 is acceptable. But as far as reading into the goal of the shard. I have, it's accuracy. Nothing more.

So if that's all that matters, and it has been all that mattered on many issues. Then this issue should be moot.

[Lothain]

I believe multiclienting is accurate--I know I did it with two 56k lines whenever people were gone from the house back in the day. Moreover, as we speak I, my fiance, and my roommate are all playing UO on 1 ip. I can't believe people would even consider preventing people from playing at all solely that other players would have more limited options.