New player looking for a venture capitalist!

Buying/Selling Everything Else

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jekkis
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Re: New player looking for a venture capitalist!

Post by jekkis »

Draconian wrote: Jekkis, the only person to step forward, wanted to friend me to a property that was unfortunately too small for the purposes that I require.
While I very much encourage the aspect of building a society with a wide variety, not jut the generic lich hunters and NPC vendor sellers for starter money, I've never been particularly fond of bending the truth. I offered you exactly the size of house you requested at that time, a large brick. What I did not do is just hand it over to you, but instead offered you the co-ownership of it. You decided to turn that down, and while I do not understand why, it's not my loss in any sense. Nor was it never a question of not having a house that is large enough for your needs. No need to lie about such a thing.

In the first place I got curious of this whole thing since I want to see what kind of ventures people get into in the society UOSA provides us - for some people it's crafting, for some it's IDOCs and for you it's obviously some form of clandestine operation. Bottom line is, we always have room for more variance in what activity goes on here and I hope I'll always be the one to encourage it, but that doesn't mean I have to be plain stupid with my assets.

Also, I haven't made a single comment about how much time you spend in game, the only thing I criticized is the payback period of investment - in the context that tens of thousands can be made in this game in a matter of hours, regardless of how little you play.

What bothers me is that you want people to give you "constructive feedback", yet you fail to respond in any manner when such criticism is represented. When I represented you a few very simplified calculations, you resorted to complaining about playing time and mocking others for the time and dedication they put into this. If you are limited on playing time, I recommend you don't complain about it here but try use your time (in-game) more efficiently.

I also criticized your request for a keep in what I find to be in a constructive manner. Or do you not see it constructive when I point out that you could get a more space-efficient building cheaper? An investment that is 200k cheaper would probably have more appeal to potential investors, too.

Now that we are on the path of criticism, as a person who reviews real-life investment decisions, I don't agree with you on keeping things secret making them more credible - it is of course wise to keep your core competences to yourself, but there's nothing represented here that even slightly resembles a business plan. Also the fact that you won't even bother to respond to simple investment related questions, like would a house 1/3 cheaper be suitable for your business, hints certain things.

It's a shame that this thread has gone the way it has, since I actually think it would have been a very interesting aspect to this game, a private bank of sorts.

Draconian
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Re: New player looking for a venture capitalist!

Post by Draconian »

I couldn't agree with you more, Jekkis. However, trade secrets are as valid as legal copyrights/patents, as a "professional" you should understand this. Since confidentiality agreements/law based remedies and patents don't exist here -- there is no way I would share my methods with someone that hasn't earned it (you.). Forgive me for telling you no! You're absolutely right, you did offer me exactly what I was asking for at the moment, and after a very good conversation with you, I came to understand that it wasn't large or secure enough at all! I sincerely thank you for your experience and wisdom. I wholly agreed with you on that, and unfortunately your offer remained the same - if not less as a result of your opposition to my stance on confidentiality. As of this moment, your offer is as it was then. Inadequate. As respectfully as possible, you just didn't offer me something I could work with.

As far as the in-game time comment, it was directed at the other guy who said he'd been in-game for 4 days and made 200k from chopping wood. I think that's great that he's accomplished so much. Frankly, I wish I had time like that!

jekkis
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Re: New player looking for a venture capitalist!

Post by jekkis »

Draconian wrote:However, trade secrets are as valid as legal copyrights/patents, as a "professional" you should understand this. Since confidentiality agreements/law based remedies and patents don't exist here -- there is no way I would share my methods with someone that hasn't earned it (you.).
Well, I'm not getting paid to educate you and since you're a headstrong case, I'll keep this short and hopefully it gives you some food for thought. You seem to be approaching this in a way that you only see this to the extremes, in other words give out no information at all because you think the only other option is to share all your "trade secrets". How do you think people in the real world get investment funding? Simply by saying "I have a great idea, give me a million" doesn't cut it around here.

Currently you are offering us: "I am a smart person, I need money for a keep." - by the way, did your business expand somewhere in between your first post where you needed a brick as you now need a keep? That's some rapid growth.

Instead, you could offer us: "I plan to use the space to set up bandage-making in such an ingenious way that I can not give out all the exact details, but I estimate I can produce bandages three times faster than the average bandage factory and thus sell them cheaper to take over the market." - this doesn't exactly give out any secrets, but would at least give investors some frame of idea and maybe someone would believe you actually have a really special way for this and thus invest in you.

You, however, don't seem to realize there's that option, but instead seem to think that there's only the other extreme of giving out all the details regarding your setup, methods and business ideas. Even a brief "I need a loan to buy a loom and a spinning wheel to start making bandages" would be more detailed than what you have on the table here. With an explanation like that, I would probably have given you a loan for those.

Backtracking a little bit, why do you keep dodging my questions? Also, if you guarantee a payback period of 7.5 months, what is the risk you speak of? If the payback is 100% certain, although takes a bit of time, the only risk that comes to my mind is you do not intend to pay back the loan or even if you intended, you'll probably be bored and quit before 7.5 months?

I'm starting to think this thread merits a spot in the trash talk section, but I think you have the potential to be the sort of player UOSA is missing, I hope you can clarify some of the details regarding your idea and return this thread on track.

Vega/Delo
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Re: New player looking for a venture capitalist!

Post by Vega/Delo »

removed I dont wanna bash him

Lady Ivy
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Re: New player looking for a venture capitalist!

Post by Lady Ivy »

Vega/Delo wrote:Not rubbin it in but if u cant play the game (which isn't going anywhere) get MW3.
MW3 is fail. Black Ops still reigns supreme. You should get BF3 for good times.

Draconian
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Re: New player looking for a venture capitalist!

Post by Draconian »

Jekkis -- I have no idea or interest in most of your post at this point. as far as your "risk" comment: If you don't understand basic economic principles, there isn't much that can be done for you! What investment has a 100% guarantee over time? That is just sillyness .....That comment is utterly terrifying because you claim to "make real-life investment decisions" (only for yourself, I hope)! Regardless of how well you grasp basic concepts, I offer you a sincere thank you for your "food for thought", and all other information you have given all of us. You have simultaneously been a (well-worded) pain in the butt, devils advocate, and a big help.
jekkis wrote: Now that we are on the path of criticism, as a person who reviews real-life investment decisions, I don't agree with you on keeping things secret making them more credible - it is of course wise to keep your core competences to yourself, but there's nothing represented here that even slightly resembles a business plan. Also the fact that you won't even bother to respond to simple investment related questions, like would a house 1/3 cheaper be suitable for your business, hints certain things.
I want to leave the rest of you negative people a little wisdom to live with, because it definitely applies. "Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds." - Albert Einstein

And for the record -- I have accomplished what I set-out to accomplish. I have had a number of people express their interest and support. I will be moving into my tower very soon thanks to others who understand the depth and complexity of something like this. Together, we are permanently changing the dynamics of this game. Together, we will change the face of what it means to be a "newbie".

:wink:
Much love,
Draconian out.

jekkis
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Re: New player looking for a venture capitalist!

Post by jekkis »

Draconian wrote:Jekkis -- I have no idea or interest in most of your post at this point. as far as your "risk" comment: If you don't understand basic economic principles, there isn't much that can be done for you! What investment has a 100% guarantee over time?
Guarantee on what? Return? According to you, the one you seek financing for. Maybe you should go revise basic economic principles...
Draconian wrote:Together, we will change the face of what it means to be a "newbie".
You've certainly done so already...

I don't know who the hell do you think you are, but if you don't bother as much as to answer simple questions regarding your plan that in no way compromise what you are attempting to do, then obviously you are not either taking your plan or your potential investors seriously. Or both. It'd be fun to hear what guarantees you have made for your investors and if they get any profit out of this, but like everything else in your plan that's probably secret too. But I'm sure you probably have given them a forecast on profits. ;)

Good luck with your new tower, it'll probably be great for your business since it's about the most space-efficient building you can get...which makes me wonder, if you're already near a tower, then why do you bother seeking for people to sca...uhh, investors. I'm sure you will make a great profit from running your business in that tower so you'll have enough gold for a keep in no time. =)

dren
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Re: New player looking for a venture capitalist!

Post by dren »

time2a wrote:if your struggeling to buy supplies like we all know we have? Then.shouldnt you optimize security and space in a small house and get yourself supplies rather than a large home
this
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Nergnog
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Re: New player looking for a venture capitalist!

Post by Nergnog »

dren wrote:
time2a wrote:if your struggeling to buy supplies like we all know we have? Then.shouldnt you optimize security and space in a small house and get yourself supplies rather than a large home
this
This.

Pirul
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Re: New player looking for a venture capitalist!

Post by Pirul »

There are only 2 things a keep is better than a tower for, and it's its CY's and it's safety from EQ. Thus, it stands to reason that some sort of live animals/monsters will be kept there, as other than gating stuff in and out, the CY's are pretty much useless now.

Obvious idea is keeping sheep, and since the OP has limited playing time availability, making bandages afk...been done, and it's illegal. Putting monsters in, well, it's also been done, and I don't know how profitable it is, but you can ask lelouche...plus if you plan on doing it afk, you can't loot the bodies unless you use an unauthorized third party program, which is also illegal.

Of course, we could all be wrong, and something really revolutionary is coming along. In any case, making a return on a keep with "limited play time" is inherantly a risky propostion, since most of the profit would be made afk, which raises a red flag (not saying anything wrong is being/will be done, it's just a warning sign).

Also, I'm with jekkis on this one, making that kind of an investment with 0 information just doesn't fly. I don't know what they're teaching you in college, but any investor with half a brain will want to see a detailed business plan and do a thourough due dilligence of the venture they're about to invest in.
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Sercruse
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Re: New player looking for a venture capitalist!

Post by Sercruse »

UO is what... 14 years old? I guarantee that this guy has nothing "revolutionary" going on.

Mikel123
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Re: New player looking for a venture capitalist!

Post by Mikel123 »

Sandro wrote:I'll give you a castle deed just for successfully trolling everyone in this thread.
OMG ON THE TRADE FORUM, THIS IS ENFORCEABLE

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Re: New player looking for a venture capitalist!

Post by Mikel123 »

btw, Pirul, sheep-shearing is illegal? Do you mean if it's sheared unattended?

I made at least a million GP with my castle roof sheep farm, 100% attended shearing with very limited effort. Helps that I had a cA sheep permit, but it is a fantastic way to make money.

On a side note, I do love how he's asking for an investor, and then talks about how slowly he's able to make money.

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Re: New player looking for a venture capitalist!

Post by Pirul »

Mikel123 wrote:btw, Pirul, sheep-shearing is illegal? Do you mean if it's sheared unattended?
Correct, since he says that he hardly has time to play, then it stands to reason, that it would be unattended.
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Re: New player looking for a venture capitalist!

Post by Mikel123 »

It's actually not that hard to do it attended, with little time. I just made sure I sheared twice a day to reset the sheep's disappearing counter (20 hours?). I think they regrow their wool every couple hours, so you could do it more.

I made a macro to use my scissors, target sheep A. Pause 1000. Use scissors, target sheep B. etc. And I'd manually move from sheep to sheep. Took about 45 seconds all in all, and then another minute or so to spin it, and another minute or two to set up a macro to cut bandages. 6 minutes a day and you can keep this up, assuming you have a few minutes in the morning and a few at night.

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