UO Second Age

The intent of this patch was not to make a decision on this issue, it's been gut wrecthing to deal with because this is nothing but my fault. They should have become breakable the day other clothing items became breakable; clearly.

All that's been done here is that a line has been drawn in the sand, the original issue of non breakable items still exists. You can consider this patch my dodge on the issue if you like; but the underlying reasons these items have not been corrected is that I specifically said "these items will not ever break", "never?", "that's correct.". If for example I said "Accounts will never be deleted for inactivity", and then you left for a year, came back and your account was deleted (for inactivity), you'd be outraged. I expect that we would find that it may or not be "era accurate" but that would not have any bearing on whether or not we should start deleting peoples accounts after I gave my word that we would not.

I'm sure holes can and will be poked in this comparison for many reasons. But to that I simply restate, no final decision has been made on existing items. This patch is a dodge, no decision has been made on existing items, only on future items.

Downs wrote: What's to stop us from compensating people who purchased their bless deeds with silver if accuracy is our goal and the majority don't like the grandfathered items?

I really appreciate people in this forum haveing a sense for compromises.

But even if people get compensated in any way, wouldnt this be the next thing thats subject for discussion?

Just take a look at the 30 pages thread (viewtopic.php?f=8&t=20056) that was prior to this patch. Compensation would be the next thing to complain about. pretty sure

Specualting about that this shard is now on its way to trammel or that era accuracy doesnt count anymore are just false.

The desicion has been made in favour for accuracy issues (they will break) the exeption is the grandfathering. Now some people may complain about "favouritism" for a few. Thats not true.. people just would have been screwed for their efforts and for contributing their time to the shard and the gameplay. Nobody has lost anything and nobody has won anything on this subject.

Other scenario would be that a part of the community will completly be right and some other players - just to not look favourized - will be sentenced. This small part of the patch was really a diplomatic solution on the whole issue and a win-win for all.

As far as grandfathering goes this is very common on this shard and nothing really special. secure pouches on the stairs (very valid example since its "just a mechanic"), glacial staffs and polar bear masks (not so valid but still comparable) just to point out a few.

greets

The best thing any of you can honestly do is accept the fact that some people have grandfathered items and some don't.

Further debate on this subject is pointless because a decision has been reached on this topic, which is what everyone wanted. Some of you don't like the outcome of said decision, but now you get to deal with it.

So in short:

Deal wit it son!

P.S. I'm going to start a thread about everyone who has locked secures on their front steps, because that's not fair and I don't have one.

P.P.S. I WANT A BALLOT BOX TOO>!!!!

DrFaustus wrote: Further debate on this subject is pointless because a decision has been reached on this topic, which is what everyone wanted. Some of you don't like the outcome of said decision, but now you get to deal with it.

Derrick wrote:But to that I simply restate, no final decision has been made on existing items. This patch is a dodge, no decision has been made on existing items, only on future items.

I guess you guys can debate for another 2 years while nothing changes on this subject what-so-ever.

And the "for" invincible blessed masked people can continue to downplay these discussions as pointless. I look forward to the next "2 years"

And the "for" invincible blessed masked people can continue to downplay these discussions as pointless. I look forward to the next "2 years"

People are selfish, what can you do. It's not like people haven't already tried to petition/fight changes just for their own self interests, the thread about people attacking others who are in guard zones while the attacker is out of the guard zone is a nice example of how some on this forum will belittle others over inaccuracies because they want to either keep items, or grief/kill others more easily with less repercussions.

I am particularly disatisfied with the thought (by many) that this decision (to grandfather in and leave open for discussion) essentially means that the items will be indefinitely grandfathered, albeit unofficially. I see absolutely no characteristics which differentiate this instance of grandfathering to many non-grandfatherings in the past, other than a few players with self interest.

GleepGlop wrote:

And the "for" invincible blessed masked people can continue to downplay these discussions as pointless. I look forward to the next "2 years"

People are selfish, what can you do. It's not like people haven't already tried to petition/fight changes just for their own self interests, the thread about people attacking others who are in guard zones while the attacker is out of the guard zone is a nice example of how some on this forum will belittle others over inaccuracies because they want to either keep items, or grief/kill others more easily with less repercussions.

Sure, some people are selfish. However, many people are also like me - I've never owned a blessed item on this shard and I'm not really sure I ever care to own one whether its breakable or not. The principle question is do we want items we paid for with the understanding that they will perform in one way or another suddenly be changed one day? I would prefer not to set a precedent where any item anyone owns can be altered on a whim.

The patch was good because mechanics were corrected in line with the shards goal of era accuracy, but thats no reason to punish players who obtained items specifically because they were unbreakable. Paying either 10+ million gold or the equivalent in silver for something that you cannot even wear is kinda crazy, few people would have bothered getting their pretty little neon sandals if they could break. It's not the players fault that this was an inaccuracy they were just playing a game.

On the flip side no one is harmed by allowing pre patch items to remain grandfathered.

I'm for era accuracy. Blessed stuff should break if they take enough damage.

caveman wrote:I'm for era accuracy. Blessed stuff should break if they take enough damage.

You'll be happy to know that blessed stuff breaks when it takes enough damage!

That's not the issue at hand. The question is, if you own a car and your state just implemented new emissions standards that your car will never pass - should you get to keep that car or be forced to buy a new one that costs $40,000?

I say you get to keep the car.

MatronDeWinter wrote:I am particularly disatisfied with the thought (by many) that this decision (to grandfather in and leave open for discussion) essentially means that the items will be indefinitely grandfathered, albeit unofficially. I see absolutely no characteristics which differentiate this instance of grandfathering to many non-grandfatherings in the past, other than a few players with self interest.

And the folks with secured chests on their steps?

Panthor the Hated wrote:

caveman wrote:I'm for era accuracy. Blessed stuff should break if they take enough damage.

You'll be happy to know that blessed stuff breaks when it takes enough damage!

That's not the issue at hand. The question is, if you own a car and your state just implemented new emissions standards that your car will never pass - should you get to keep that car or be forced to buy a new one that costs $40,000?

I say you get to keep the car.

Poor example. This is a FREE GAME, that you pay nothing for, so you can not compare it to IRL situations. The only thing any of us have invested here is time. Any money you have donated or paid is purely a gift or donation and is in no way a form of payment for any ingame item.

Everything else on this server is subject to change at any time due to era accuract mechanics and new things coming to light. I am all for these grandfathered items being treated like any other blessed item. Everyone else is expected to deal with the ever changing server as we aim for better era accuracy, I do not see why blessed clothing should be any different than any other item or skill that is found to be inaccurate.

Money donated? wtf?

You know theres currency in the game, right?

I don't think he caught what you said exactly. The amount of gold (or whatever resource) paid for an item should have no bearing in it's grandfather-ability. The staff even said that not only should all items been made breakable at the mass release of clothing bless deeds (which I suggested that very day), but that the reasoning for their decision in this matter was based on the implications of "going back on their word". I really do commend Derrick on his integrity in that regard, but I simply find "staff told me x" to be too broad of a concept from which to derive a promise. I do not see this as a just verdict because "staff has told me many things", and after one patch or another, some of those things are not true and remain non-grandfathered.