UO Second Age

Posted: **Mon Oct 05, 2009 4:51 am**

Mini heal seems too overpowered. It has become commonplace for people to use 4-5 chained mini heals to endure a mana dump while avoiding disruption. Some crybaby pvpers have "quit" the game because they do not like to deal with said mini heal spammers, which in their defense is very frustrating.

What research was done to make mini heal this effective? Why does mini heal ALWAYS heal 11 to 13 damage? That seems like a very quirky and firm range? Compare this to GH which heals 40-50? (assuming gm magery)?

Shouldn't it heal up to 13 hps, but as little as 3?

Id like to see a discussion about this specific matter, no flaming nor tangents. What formula do we use for mini heal, and why?

Posted: **Mon Oct 05, 2009 4:56 am**

That's what I've been saying. It heals, I believe, 11-13 dmg.

It's a simple matter -- and one that is clearly inaccurate -- that would have vast, positive influences on pvp here. But it won't be tweaked, even though nobody really knows the exact forumla mini heal should follow (sorry, the 16 dmg mini heals in the demo are also markedly wrong, hence they're not on live UOSA) because this is the new status quo.

Posted: **Mon Oct 05, 2009 5:05 am**

Fwerp wrote:That's what I've been saying. It heals, I believe, 11-13 dmg.

It's a simple matter -- and one that is clearly inaccurate -- that would have vast, positive influences on pvp here. But it won't be tweaked, even though nobody really knows the exact forumla mini heal should follow (sorry, the 16 dmg mini heals in the demo are also markedly wrong, hence they're not on live UOSA) because this is the new status quo.

There are probably screenshots of battles during t2a when people use mini heal to escape death.

UOA had an option irrc that displayed how much damage was healed.

Anything outside the 11-13 range would be enough to derail our current setup?

Also if the formula from the demo is not used on live, then what formula is in place now and *WHY*?

Posted: **Mon Oct 05, 2009 6:49 am**

Maybe it's not the amount healed, but any chance that it wasn't allowed to be recasted so quickly? I do remember mini healing not being "useful" in most situations; it was usually considered a waste of regs as a single heal.

Posted: **Mon Oct 05, 2009 6:56 am**

Faust wrote:Here is an interesting timeline involving the heal "in mani" spell stating specific values over the lifetime of the game.

Batlin - 1997 - http://forum.uosecondage.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=10367&start=45 wrote: My Prima guide has Heal as Magery/10+(1-6).

It also has Greater Heal as 4*Magery/10

This was published in 1997 before the release of the game based on information supplied by Origin.

It would be odd for the T2A demo to continue to use those exact same numbers, unless they were still in use.

UO Demo - July 1998 - Batlins Decompiled Demo Project wrote: Actual Code: Q5MJ = ((getSkillLevel(user, 0x19) / 0x0A) + dice(0x01, 0x06));
Code Translation: ((Magery / 10) + 1-6)

December 2000 - http://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.computer.ultima.online/browse_thread/thread/f1ea130a631b86fb/c164571d9b1ba7b4?hl=nl&q=%22ultima+online%22+%22in+mani%22 wrote: GM Magery won't be worth much offensively without Evaluate Int but
50 point In Vas Manis are a hell of a thing. If you go this route
you'll want to have a UOA macro for In Mani + Target Self, that'll
give you uninterruptable 15 point heals for 4 mana at a keystroke,
a great way to save your ass long enough for a bandage or In Vas Mani
to bail you out.

UO Stratics - September 2002 - http://web.archive.org/web/20021010010902/uo.stratics.com/content/guides/magic.shtml wrote: Can heal up to 14 damage, absolutely vital in combat. This spell cannot be interrupted. Period.

UO.com - December 2002 - http://web.archive.org/web/20030104205605/http://guide.uo.com/magic_0.html#1e wrote: Restores Hit Points (Caster's Magery/10) + (1 to 5)
(11-15 pts. at 100 magery) Cannot be Resisted

UO Stratics - April 2003 - http://web.archive.org/web/20030413070015/uo.stratics.com/content/guides/magic.shtml wrote:Heals ((Magery / 10) + (1 to 3)) damage. Absolutely vital in combat. This spell cannot be interrupted. Period.

UO.com - April 2003 - http://web.archive.org/web/20030417072201/guide.uo.com/magic_0.html wrote:Restores Hit Points (Caster's Magery/10) + (1 to 3)
(9-13 pts. at 100 magery) Cannot be Resisted

UO Stratics - Present - http://uo.stratics.com/php-bin/show_content.php?content=30684 wrote: Heals ((Magery / 10) + (1 to 3)) damage. Absolutely vital in combat, as it is the fastest way to heal for a mage.

UO.com - Present - http://www.uoherald.com/guide/guide.php?guideId=35 wrote:Restores Hit Points (Caster's Magery/10) + (1 to 3)
(9-13 pts. at 100 magery) Cannot be Resisted

Posted: **Mon Oct 05, 2009 7:40 am**

Mini Heals always healed that much damage, and its always been a tactic to spam mini heal thru dumps. If your dump doesn't include the poison spell than it deserves to be mini healed thru.

Posted: **Mon Oct 05, 2009 8:30 am**

Actually, magery heals heal through poison here.

Posted: **Mon Oct 05, 2009 9:04 am**

so current mini heal is based off of the decompiled demo and dec 2000? okay...

Posted: **Mon Oct 05, 2009 9:12 am**

Baldamier wrote:Actually, magery heals heal through poison here.

Eh, your right, its been a while for me.

Posted: **Mon Oct 05, 2009 9:19 am**

I don't PvP but I do have to say it seems a bit off that an e-bolts min damage on someone with 0 resist is 6hp

Yet In mani's min heal for 100 magery is 10...something seems off

Posted: **Mon Oct 05, 2009 9:21 am**

poogoblin wrote:I don't PvP but I do have to say it seems a bit off that an e-bolts min damage on someone with 0 resist is 6hp

Yet In mani's min heal for 100 magery is 10...something seems off

There is no way to get a 6 hp damage on someone with zero resist from EB.

There's about a 3.3% (one in 30) chance of EB doing < 10 hp against someone with GM resist, from a caster with GM Magery and Eval.

Posted: **Mon Oct 05, 2009 9:24 am**

Pro wrote:so current mini heal is based off of the decompiled demo and dec 2000? okay...

Actually, I think it's 11-13 on our shard, which means it's based off of the quotes from 2003 to present. I think this was more of a compromise between what we had originally and the actual sources from our era, because of all of the whining.

If we were actually basing it on sources related to our time period, it would be 11-16. There's no way someone would claim it would heal 15 points of health if it only did 11-13.

I don't know what it was in T2A, part of me thinks it was reduced a bit in UO:R, but in any case, if I were a betting man I'd surely bet on the guide plus the "15" quote plus, most importantly, the actual demo code.

Posted: **Mon Oct 05, 2009 9:25 am**

Derrick wrote:
poogoblin wrote:I don't PvP but I do have to say it seems a bit off that an e-bolts min damage on someone with 0 resist is 6hp

Yet In mani's min heal for 100 magery is 10...something seems off
There is no way to get a 6 hp damage on someone with zero resist from EB.

There's about a 3.3% (one in 30) chance of EB doing < 10 hp against someone with GM resist, from a caster with GM Magery and Eval.

I used this from another post you had Derrick

Derrick wrote:The era stratics resist calculator gives a minimum damage of 5 for EB with Gm Magery, Eval and Resist: http://www.uosecondage.com/stratics/UOS ... ulator.htm

Put in 100 Mage 100 Eval and 0 resist...it spits out approx min damage as 6.

I'm probably misunderstanding the calculator or something

Posted: **Mon Oct 05, 2009 9:28 am**

Mikel123 wrote:Actually, I think it's 11-13 on our shard, which means it's based off of the quotes from 2003 to present. I think this was more of a compromise between what we had originally and the actual sources from our era, because of all of the whining.

This is correct. We found 11-16 in demo code and 11-13 an stratics references; and while it was more likely 11-16 we had nothing definitive to show that, and we opted for the lesser of the two possible ranges.

Posted: **Mon Oct 05, 2009 12:23 pm**

There's about a 3.3% (one in 30) chance of EB doing < 10 hp against someone with GM resist, from a caster with GM Magery and Eval

Maybe this is what it is supposed to be, but I think there may be a coding error. This seems to happen FAR more than 3.3% of the time, and it also seems to happen consecutively (maybe there is a better randomizer?).
When I was investigating the exact range of miniheal for son/felix, I shot four ebolts at myself and I was still above 50% health. Maybe 10-14 dmg ebolts are far, far more common -- but, I think there could very well be a coding discrepancy.

UO Second Age

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