[Era Accuracy] Bank Checks

[MatronDeWinter]

http://wiki.uosecondage.com/index.php?t ... 03/09/2000

Here is the patch that impliments Bank Checks, I find it rather "out" of era (though it may be technically IN era), it is certainly not the greatest time during the second age in my opinion, and I am sure many will agree. Your statement justifying checks on the grounds that they were "In" some era of T2A is quite moot, the majority of the T2A era was spent without checks. Using this patch as a referance (laughably), the following should be implimented... (I went through and pick-n-chose what I felt)

1 Second Delay on Enticement and Detect Hidden.
(I would personally love to see this)

With skill gain being increased in general, we have made changes to make macroing no longer yield better skill gain results than normal game play.

Oh yes, the Anti-Macro code, everyone wants that too right?

Passive Eval/Med/Music/Hide/Lumberjack/Lore/Detect skill gains. Thats right, passive Lumberjacking, the next step is to include the LJ bonus for swords combat!

Fishermen will fish up serpants regardless of success/failure.

Tinker traps become completely usless.


Okay, not too bad right? Ruin some tinkerers fun, kill a few fishermen, no big deal. Well if that patch is accurate, then each one before it must be too right? Lets check those out too...


Moonstones will be found on various monsters

Pet transfers will perform the loyalty checks before the transfer window appears.

Yup, No more nightmares for non-tamers.

Single clicking the left mouse button on a moongate will give you a description of what lies through the gate. This will allow you to know where the gate is currently going without having to jump through them over and over again until you reach your destination. This will help improve server performance as less players will need to “jump” through moongates.

Blasphemy

* The higher a character’s dexterity, the less time it will take to complete a heal.
* The amount of healing a character loses due to a finger slip will be reduced with a higher dexterity.

Oh yes, this one means Tank-Mages become obsolete.

Untamed monsters and animals in houses will “die” after a certain amount of time. These monsters and animals will be eligible for “death”, within a given amount of time, under the following circumstances:

* If the monster/animal is not targeted.
* If the monster/animal does not receive or deliver damage.

Say goodbye the your castle-roof sheep pens.

You may only have one escort at a time.
You will have to wait approximately 15 minutes between each escort.

Pack horses and pack llamas will have their carrying capacity increased from 400 to 1,600 stones

Land Surveying Tool (enough said)

You will no longer be able to use the stealing skill to determine if someone is "perma-gray".

Players who are not in the Thieves Guild will not be able to steal from other players at all.

The bug involving the ability to “pre-cast” spells and then use or take items will be fixed. After casting a spell, the targeting cursor will disappear if the player does any of the following:

* Equips or unequips an item.
* Takes an item.
* Drags an item from their backpack.

Everyone likes this one too... Make a poll and find out.

Clean Up Britannia (Phase III)

The final phase in the Clean Up Britannia program will be the implementation of item decay in houses. The decay rate will be the same as with items outside.

Once in effect, house item decay will affect all items that are not:

* Placed in a secure container.
* Locked down.
* A house add-on (such as an anvil or a loom).
* Placed by an IGM or GM.

Item Decay on Boats

We will be activating decay for items left on the deck of a boat. These items will decay at the same rate as items left on the ground outside.

Only items left on the deck of a boat will decay, items in the hold of a boat will not be subject to decay.

* All Small Houses have 3 and 425 lock downs for a total of 425 items.
* Brick Houses have 8 secure and 1100 lock downs for a total of 1100 items.
* Large Patio Houses have 8 secures and 1100 lock downs for a total of 1100 items.
* Both Two Story Houses have 10 secures and 1370 lock downs for a total of 1370 items.
* Towers have 15 secures and 2119 lock downs for a total of 2119 items.
* Small Stone Keeps have 18 secures and 2625 lock downs for a total of 2625 items.
* Castles have 28 secures and 4076 lock downs for a total of 4076 items.

Great! Totally secure trammel houses!

Temporary Change to Gates Sep 9 1999 9:13AM CST

* After going through a gate cast by a player, there will be a random delay of 3 to 10 seconds before you can go though that gate again, or through any other gate.

Note that this change is temporary. We will update you again once it is changed back.

Note: This was not changed back until UO:R

# "Young" players will not be able to loot player corpses at all.
# "Young" players will not be able to poison another player with a poisoned weapon.

Yes, "Young" player status

NPC shopkeepers will now buy the following items:

* Warforks

This was mentioned as out of era in the forums before.

and so on...


I really feel that a great deal of these are, or are setting the core foundation for UO:R. Tank mages will love the inability to precast, and the new dexer ability to heal in 6 seconds. Gaining skills becomes a frustrating mess of attempting to evade the anti macro code, and worst of all, with multi-clienting, I will be the first person to create a "Young" character to stash my gold while I farm. PKing will become a dead artform.

[Zim]

^^

The argument is solid, this SHOULD be patched either backward or forward. Most likely backward. However a couple other features in our game are currently bent in favor of playability, game style, and just plain FUN. I think this should be taken into account as well.

I think the removal of checks would detrimentally hurt the server. "Sure" you can find ways to transfer 1,000,000 gold in 15 different piles that weigh 15k stones for 1 item, but that hassle alone would kill a lot of the game for people. I've only had to deal with up to 300,000 at a time, but I dont think I would bother with player interaction anymore :p I also realize this is a T2A server and life is rough. ^_^

[Altay]

I don't quite see what the purpose of your incredibly long post was Matron.

I personally did not read the patch notes regarding bank checks, as Derrick already pointed out that they are 'technically IN era', but that's besides the point. The point is, you can't pick and choose which aspects of the T2A era we should have, and which parts of it we shouldn't have.

So long as Bank checks were a part of T2A, they're free game for being added to the server. Just as everything else you mentioned Matron, but the whole point is, before making any changes, vote on it. I'm sure all the 'un popular' stuff you mentioned in your epic post will get voted down.

On the topic of being T2A accurate:
There were no such things as 'CAPTURE THE FLAG' or 'DOUBLE DOMINATION' back on the T2A I played. Nor were there any Statues that can be exchanged for rares or any other 'enhancements' added to this server. The goal of being strictly T2A accurate is pretty lame, especially when no one knows exactly 'when' during T2A the server is trying to emulate [T2A on LAUNCH? T2A in the middle? T2A at the end?]. I'd imagine the #1 priority is to create a fun UO server where folks can enjoy themselves, after all, aren't we playing this game for.. you know, fun?

It's past 4AM, my typing gets progressively worse as it gets later, so I apologize if i typed out any incoherent sentences.

[MatronDeWinter]

I don't quite see what the purpose of your incredibly long post was Matron.

.....The point is, you can't pick and choose which aspects of the T2A era we should have, and which parts of it we shouldn't have.

My point was just that, we get Bank checks, we also get dex-healing and lose pre-cast. I simply meant to say that allowing inaccuracies to slide by can slowly lead towards this becoming Pre-UO:RenAge.com.

[Altay]

If that's the case Matron, Derrick or the community, needs to pick an EXACT place in time DURING T2A, and the 'goal' would be to emulate that ONE point in time.

Or we can just do it my way, and have all the T2A 'features' in a pool. and pick and choose through them, so long as they're all IN T2A, and so long as the community wants them.

I don't know why you're complaining Matron. I bet you can make A LOT More gold AS IS than with removing bank checks. Think about it, you just go out and claim you're buying rares, show them a check, put the rare on last target, gg steal it. Getting rid of checks would make this impossible!

/logoff

[Charles Darwin]

You know, I feel like this is a difficult pill to swallow. In one hand, I enjoy bank checks, not that I use them frequently due to my broke, newbish, nature. (under one month here calling UOSA my home, and I'm proud to call it that) But I do have hopes and dreams. Some of those dreams being, accumulating bulk resources from players if I have to, and eventually buying expensive property. Not having commodity deeds, already will make buying or selling bulk ingots, regs, boards, etc. very difficult, but worrying about gold, makes both ends uncomfortably cumbersome, potentially discouraging sales across the board, and making it more difficult to acquire resources for everyone. I also worry about the posibility of losing an opportunity to buy or sell a piece of property. For example, maybe two parties schedules don't line up easily during the course of their game play habits. Lets be honest, we all sometimes play at weird hours, and having to worry about getting a third party, coordinating everyone at the same time, and worry about losing a large some of gold... Ouch - And in no way am I complaining about hardships without commodity deeds. I can't stand them, they make the game to easy and carefree, but I want to make it clear that removing the safety to trade gold in bulk, is drastic.

Now these are very basic issues that could arise. They are also very basic issues I can't possibly prove or confirm in any way. But I do believe that these issues I've lightly discussed might cause these types of problems.

Now in the other hand I understand the lure of era accuracy. And I want that over any compromise, because as the mission statement of UOSA clearly states, "We do not intend to ever change any aspect of normal gameplay to particularly favor any playstyle or to protect or further expose any players to to the in-game risk that was a large part of this era." What can I say, this pretty much sums everything up beautifully. But using this argument is easy, and it also overlooks the real factor that T2A was an evolving time of Ultima Online, and this shard currently adopts methods of play style throughout the course of, The Second Age. The discussion of checks being era accurate really brings attention to the large pink elephant standing in the room - What exactly is the time period we are trying to represent, within T2A. Matron just detailed a very lengthy bit of patch work that changed a multitude of things, including the speed of bandage times, and another change I would love to see; Non-tamers riding nightmares! Don't let them!

I think this is a healthy discussion for UOSA, and at heart, I am leaning toward the abolishment of bank checks, only to make the game harder. The real way to resolve this issue I think, is to formally conduct a poll, or declare what time period exactly we are emulating during T2A and never look back.

*a little bit of a friendly rant *

But if we are taking bank checks away, then should we also changed the whole "That wasn't even challenging" message when a past tamed animal is tamed, therefore resulting in no potential gain?

I have searched, and searched these forums and google archive searches, for patch notes or proof, and haven't found anything comfirming this as era accurate.

Flame me if you must for my potential ignorance

[MatronDeWinter]

The problem is, that you cannot simply take a poll.

Watch the outcome of this one...
http://forum.uosecondage.com/viewtopic. ... 05&start=0
The majority (and deciding factor) will always vote the option that benefits them. As thieves are an obvious minority, loss is expected.

When I first started playing here my character was a bard enticer. I chose enticement because it is an amusing skill that also helps in your gain of music, and I eventually went on to Provocation as almost all new players do. I was saddened to learn that enticement was completely usless and set about posting a bug report to correct the issue.

http://forum.uosecondage.com/viewtopic. ... lit=entice

It was eventually corrected in the very next patch, and while not quite accurate yet, I am happy with the results and I realise finding information for such an often-considered pointless and little used skill can be difficult.

I started playing here with the intent to check it out for a day or two, but decided to stay based almost completely on the rational outcome of this bug report. I found the staff more than willing to work towards era-accuracy, above anything else. This creates a very equal playing field. We all know what to expect from T2A, and while some things may/may-not be off, the pursuit of correction is always momentus. That is what is truly great about this shard. Owo(Origin Worlds Online) chose to go the direction of the masses, polling select individuals, and I believe that is why the game is in the state it is. People do not like to be killed/robbed/looted, everyone wants to be the winner, spawning a pointless game of neon-item collection and virtually zero risk. Anyone here can argue points, with referanced material if they believe something is off, that is great, but once you start making exceptions, pretty soon it will become just like every other shard out there. A test center for PvPers with a low population.

[Kaivan]

Just to give an answer to the time frame question, the aim of UOSA is to replicate the game during late 1999. Generally speaking, 99% of our patches will be from the October to December 1999 time frame, with the exception of only a couple of deliberately chosen patches outside of that time frame due to some of the realities of freeshards as a whole. Naturally, with that particular time frame as our goal, things such as secure pet and house trading as well essentially all of the post-2000 changes are going to be avoided.

[Derrick]

Derrick, Since the Blessed Checks ARE 'IN ERA", There is no point in arguing / discussing this.

One of the reasons this falls "out of era" for the purpose of T2A is that we hold a "patch cut-off-date" of Dec. 1999. There were a lot of patches in 2000 that led up to UO:R and for consistency we've not honored any patches in 2000 at all. On the other hand, removing checks and making the other indicated changes is a lot of work; and it's been put off mostly because there are plenty of other things to do as well, and also because of the division about it. When possible I concentrate my efforts on issues that are either game-breaking bugs, or things that there is almost unanimous demand for fixing.

[noxmonk]

During the T2A time period, programs such as razor, euo, and uoe were considered illegal and you could swiftly be banned for using them. We should all have to use UOConnect or editing of the hosts file(if that's how it's still done), to connect to the shard and all others would be banned. That's era accurate.

[Faust]

You had to have been a total moron running around the bank spamming that you use the programs to be banned for using UOE or UOP. I used UOE from '98 all the way until it was wiped out by OSI in early '00. I honestly don't know one person that was ever actually banned for using the programs. I know guilds that was banned for having links to the programs on their guild's web site but not for the actual use of the program itself.

EUO is illegal here, btw.

[noxmonk]

You had to have been a total moron running around the bank spamming that you use the programs to be banned for using UOE or UOP. I used UOE from '98 all the way until it was wiped out by OSI in early '00. I honestly don't know one person that was ever actually banned for using the programs. I know guilds that was banned for having links to the programs on their guild's web site but not for the actual use of the program itself.

Doesn't change the fact that using it was bannable.

EUO is illegal here, btw.

well aware. I reported someone using an EUO mining script the other day to Derrick "a negro slave" I think was the name. Not sure what happened to him.

[Faust]

Banning was a policy not a game mechanic.

There is a distinct difference between the two. One can be replicated the other can not. For example, macroing was a bannable offense too. However, each shard was completely different. Baja wasn't very strict on macroing at all. I have heard other shards being very strict. Your experiences of a particular policy would vary greatly from one person to the next.

This is why in my opinion that Derrick develops his policy based on the principles that he believes in just like the seperate GM's did on their relative shard they were policing when it comes down to policy making.

[Naljier]

jeezus removing trade windows or bank checks would be very fuggin annoying, wtf is wrong with you people

[Faust]

No one said anything about removing trade windows.

I have a feeling that you're relatively new to the development scene for this shard Naj. I would highly recommend that you read the front part of the web site that is strictly enforced for the in game mechanics here.

Simply The Way It Was

Since inception, the goal, vision and rationale of even creating this shard has been very simple but unique:

- We aim to replicate the T2A era as best we can and within technical limitations as a whole.
- We do not intend to ever change any aspect of normal gameplay to particularly favor any playstyle or to protect or further expose any players to to the in-game risk that was a large part of this era.
- We will especially not pull aspects of other eras into this one, even with an overwhelming demand of players.