Stamina Drop when dealt damage

[Mikel123]

First, let me explain my recollection.

• When you took a big hit from something, whether it be a halberd or an ebolt or whatever (say, 15+ damage), you lost some stamina
• mace weapons would do an additional stamina loss
• when your health got low, you began to lose more stamina from hits
• when your health got low, running became progressively more of a stamina drain

I think the stamina loss on this shard is way too low, especially for macing. I hit someone with a black staff at full health for 18 damage, and they lose 3 stamina (12% of their stamina, as they had 25). Then I whack them again for 30, and they lose ZERO stamina.

I tried two ebolts on full-health guys. Each hit for about 24 damage, and one took away 3 stamina and the other took away zero. I'm not sure why there's no consistency here...

Select quotes:

April, 1999:
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.game ... 102fa57fa2

Today my stamina kept dropping and dropping like never before: when I got
hit, when I ran. Before, I would NEVER see a decrease when I got hit. Is
there a new patch or something? Just curious.

Yep. If you're taking damage from a mace like weapon the drop is
drmatic. (it also tears through your armour and your clothes. I was
sparring with a friend and it destroyed everything we had on in just 15
minutes. Wierd stuff)

But, I later fought a gazer
and his spells were killing my stamina, which has never happened before, not
even minor. And, even later, a ratman, I repeat RATMAN, was taking off all
kinds of stamina. Oh yah, I was well fed every time, too. Well, I'll see
what happens today.

June 1999:
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.game ... fa4dd536a3

Well last but no least this damn stamina drop is also very annoying.
When my mage (25 DEX) gets hit with an Flamestrike doing 40 damage his
stamina drops like 4 or 5 points, but if my well trained and fast
fighter gets hit with the same amount of damage he loses like 40 !! stamina
making him slow like hell. OSI told me stamina loss is a percentage from
your maximum stamina, well that's stupid like hell ! It should be a
percentage of the damage you take but not of the amount you have

September 1999:
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.game ... 98b2d62df4

4-5 hits with a q-staff and my 99 stamina fighter is an immobile training
dummy. The most common pk skill combo on SP is magery and mace fighting.
After the mana dump the victim has lost 50% of the stamina anyway and the
rest of it is taken away in a matter of seconds.

The problem is not that it 'works' as PvP weapon, the problem is that the
stamina loss is much too high for PvP. I really like the idea of stamina
loss and armour damage for mace weapons..but when I fight a mace fighter I
always wonder why I have a 100 (or 99 with plate gorget) stamina fighter..I
have the high dex advantage the first 3 seconds..thats it then..and that
gives the mage/mace fighter a huge advantage, because he doesn't have to
worry that his spells get interrupted..

They either have to reduce the stamina loss or allow that a poisoned weapon
poisons with every hit, like the mace takes the stamina away with every hit.

[Mikel123]

Bump for getting some attention. This is very important to accuracy, and we're way off right now.

[Perception]

I'm not sure why there's no consistency here...

That's accurate UO

Pretty sure that stamina loss from hits was ripped from the decompiled demo, willing to bet it's a diceroll chance. Only Derrick can confirm really.

[Mikel123]

The extra stamina loss from maces came in Feb, 1999, so it won't be found in the demo. It should absolutely always be a non-zero number. Stratics says "3-5 additional stamina" lost, which sounds reasonable, assuming the damage itself is sapping stamina appropriately.

I remember ebolts taking a lot more than 3 stamina away; I remember taking double-digit stamina losses from flamestrikes.

[Perception]

The extra stamina loss from maces came in Feb, 1999, so it won't be found in the demo. It should absolutely always be a non-zero number. Stratics says "3-5 additional stamina" lost, which sounds reasonable, assuming the damage itself is sapping stamina appropriately.

I remember ebolts taking a lot more than 3 stamina away; I remember taking double-digit stamina losses from flamestrikes.

I think within the last year or two it's become increasingly clear how often Stratics was quite a bit off... You could simply check the demo quickly for stamina losses on each hit, I will when I get home from work if no one else has.

[Mikel123]

Really, the biggest error I've seen on it was the katana speed thing. I've found Stratics to be pretty reliable, though I actually prefer the archived posts on Google Groups much better (for example, the gem above about stamina drop being a percentage of stamina, according to someone who spoke to a GM). There's a lot of posts on there where people describe things in such a manner that I think it's a very very reliable source.

And it's not just stratics... look at my last quote, in which someone is talking about maces reducing stamina on every single hit.

Thanks for checking the demo (I don't have it), but I'm afraid the results are going to be misleading. See my quotes again; the threads on increased stamina loss from damage (magic and physical) start around April 1999, and they specifically mention that it's a new behavior.

[ClowN]

agree, maces are bad here. they were much more effective in era.

[Nicoladen]

I remember maces to be big stamina eaters aswell and you really needed to quaff a refresh. I think it was after this change a lot of hally mages changed to qstaffs.

I don't remeber losing any stamina from spells however. 2 mages fighting with 25 dex each......zzZZZzzZZ
edit: Oh and I can definately second the stamina loss from being low on health. below 10 health or so the stamina loss was dramatic as hell and the fleeing would come to a full stop in a few steps..
I'll try and find some pic or something to back it up

here we go:

When your health gets that low your stamina drops as you move so it's best
to run before it gets below like 20-25 so you can get far enough away to
heal or escape. The "pulled back like on a string" effect is rubber band lag
which probably occurs in your case because you tried moving when your
stamina hit 0 and it caused a back log of the system message. Only way to
solve that is to keep an eye on your stamina and carry a couple of refresh
potions to down if it's droping real fast.

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.game ... c1e6c1d1f6

[Mikel123]

Screenshots would be great, but don't forget we have:

But, I later fought a gazer and his spells were killing my stamina

When my mage (25 DEX) gets hit with an Flamestrike doing 40 damage his
stamina drops like 4 or 5 points, but if my well trained and fast
fighter gets hit with the same amount of damage he loses like 40 !!

The most common pk skill combo on SP is magery and mace fighting.
After the mana dump the victim has lost 50% of the stamina anyway and the
rest of it is taken away in a matter of seconds.

There's pretty overwhelming evidence that spells reduced stamina. This is yet another reason why people here are able to farm gold faster than they otherwise would. In 1999, if you were farming liches for example, you'd pretty much be at <10 stamina the entire time, since people would never pack red potions to fight them. And, if they hit you with a spell at the wrong time, you'd be stuck at 0 stamina and unable for a few moments to run away to finish a bandage.

[Nicoladen]

Screenshots would be great, but don't forget we have:

But, I later fought a gazer and his spells were killing my stamina

When my mage (25 DEX) gets hit with an Flamestrike doing 40 damage his
stamina drops like 4 or 5 points, but if my well trained and fast
fighter gets hit with the same amount of damage he loses like 40 !!

The most common pk skill combo on SP is magery and mace fighting.
After the mana dump the victim has lost 50% of the stamina anyway and the
rest of it is taken away in a matter of seconds.

There's pretty overwhelming evidence that spells reduced stamina. This is yet another reason why people here are able to farm gold faster than they otherwise would. In 1999, if you were farming liches for example, you'd pretty much be at <10 stamina the entire time, since people would never pack red potions to fight them. And, if they hit you with a spell at the wrong time, you'd be stuck at 0 stamina and unable for a few moments to run away to finish a bandage.

But what I think is incorrect is that the actual spell would take any stamina - More likely it was caused by moving when low on hp. I dont know, you might be right, but I never experienced any stamina issues unless being low on health, og fighting a macer.

[Mikel123]

So, I'll refute it thus:

First, I remember what you're saying, but I also remember the damage itself causing a stamina drop on its own.

Second... no one says that. Look especially at the middle one - that's about as explicit as you can get, in terms of citing the stamina loss being due to the damage of the spell.

[Derrick]

The stamina loss as well have it implemented is that "fatigue on damage" from the '98 OSI code, which is based on the amount of damage done, in addition your heath, stamina etc. + The stamina loss from Macing, which is 3-5 points per hit as stated by OSI, + Movement fatigue loss also from '98 OSI code, which is based on a few factors, but most significantly your total weight, and your health.

That all being said; when I went to look for the specific code that applies the "fatigue on damage" to verify my statements above; it seems not to be found!?! This was patched to be the exact OSI formula over a year ago (I think); I'll have to do some research on this to see if I'm just blind this morning, or if it possible got removed in error when I recoded the weapons system, although the code is unified for all damage, not just weapon damage.

Thanks! I'll update soon.

Update for historians:
This appears to be the patch that corrected that stamina loss on damage to the OSI formula
http://forum.uosecondage.com/viewtopic. ... 85&#p99485

Update 2:
I was blind. The Fatigue On Damage is in, and unchanged since Oct 2009, using the OSI formula.

The stamina drop from maces (3-5 stamina), which is separate is applied whenever the weapons hits. This may warrant further verification that it should only be applied when a hit is made, and that the OSI statement of 3 to 5 points of stamina lost is correct.