Tournament Discrepensies

[Ronk]

the poison spell doesnt belong to a class of player
it is a spell in the spellbook
to say one class of player has an advantage/disadvantage because of this spell is wrong
my blacksmith can cast this spell, my fisherman can cast this spell, my mage can cast this spell, my dexxer can cast this spell, my tamer can cast this spell, my bard can cast this spell

to say a mage has an advantage because of this spell is dumb when every single character ever to be created can cast this spell

if a dexxer wants to poison a mage because they feel it would even the playing field, do it with this spell

Yeah. My blacksmith can drink potions, my fisherman can drink potions, my mage can drink potions. Just because you can do it doesn't' mean it belongs in a tournament.

All of those people you mentioned can also recall...but that doesn't happen in a tournament either.

[BlackFoot]

wow thanks for the contribution
and missing the point
my dexxer cna cast this spell why cant you
why do i as a dexxer so badly need such a huge advantage to compete

[Ronk]

wow thanks for the contribution
and missing the point
my dexxer cna cast this spell why cant you
why do i as a dexxer so badly need such a huge advantage to compete

So why not just say that?

Removing the poison spell from being used in any tournament, where the poisoning skill and/or potions are not allowed, would be more beneficial to encouraging more classes/templates of people and would help discourage the need for certain skill sets to have a chance.

[BlackFoot]

i still dont see whats wrong with the current system that would require this change
there is no advantage to a mage over a dexxer, both have pros and cons and both have a chance to win

[Flash Hardstar]

The advantage was already highlighted. a simple 2nd circle spell called poison can stop anyone with the healing skill from using it for near 40 seconds. THAT is a huge advantage

[Flash Hardstar]

poison isn't that difficult for a mage to reither cure or heals through. A few of you have fought so hard and srgued stupid points evading the question and claiming poisoning will ruin duels and if a mage gets poisoned its game over. OK THEN! heres my proposal

NO POISONING AT ALL, NO CASTED, SO SKILL ENDUCED POISONING.

after readin 14 pages of this post any mage who tries to contradict this statement is a hippocrit and clearly out for the easy trophies.

THIS was the argument at hand.

[BlackFoot]

yea see that arguement is fail
so you still havnt given a real arguement why poisoning shoudl be introduced or the spell removed
the simple fact that you as a player havnt figered out how to counter this simple tactic is not reason enough to change the system

And you need to understand that me argueing this is nothign personal i can win these tournaments on my mage and much easier on my dexxer
im going to argue opposite because both sides need to be heard

[Ronk]

yea see that arguement is fail
so you still havnt given a real arguement why poisoning shoudl be introduced or the spell removed
the simple fact that you as a player havnt figered out how to counter this simple tactic is not reason enough to change the system

And you need to understand that me argueing this is nothign personal i can win these tournaments on my mage and much easier on my dexxer
im going to argue opposite because both sides need to be heard

The argument has been made. In short, with poisoning (the spell or skill) it requires someone to have a certain skill or a certain amount of mana to compete. Without it they really can't compete.

The main reason everyone said no to poisoned weapons is that cure potions are not allowed. The same is a valid argument for why the poison spell should not be allowed. No potions, no poison. Alternatively, allow potions and allow poison (which would be my person preference since it requires a person to think quick on their feet and use the cure potion).

[BlackFoot]

it requires someone to have a certain skill or a certain amount of mana to compete. Without it they really can't compete.

i think this is the point of pvp

your arguement is that the character you are trying to use is inferior or you cant use him properly, so we should change the rules, that doesn make sense

[Ronk]

it requires someone to have a certain skill or a certain amount of mana to compete. Without it they really can't compete.

i think this is the point of pvp

your arguement is that the character you are trying to use is inferior or you cant use him properly, so we should change the rules, that doesn make sense

How can you claim a character is inferior when certain features/skills/items are banned? A character who normally relies on cure potions to cure is inferior only in an artificial tournament that allows a mage to cast poison but not one else...and no cure potions.

Right now a mage vs a dexxer is boring. The mage poisons, the dexxer cures. The mage poisons...the dexxer cures. Repeat until the dexxers limited mana supply is gone and throw in lots of running back and forth.

I propose allowing the poison spell but also allow cure potions. The reason I would suggest allowing both is because with a timely poison you can interrupt/waste a dexxers bandage attempt if he is not quick enough to chug a cure. It leaves in the tactic of a poison without making it a doom all/end all against those who chose not have magery.

As brought up above, everyone would have the poisoning skill due to innate intelligence. But, low poisoning gives a chance to poison yourself. So if cure potions are allowed then also allow poisoning if the skill is used. Again, no deadly poison. Deadly would be a completely different debate and a different can of worms.

[BlackFoot]

im going to argue here that your tactics described here to defend against the mages poisoning is a very bad tactic and its obvious why it fails, and that your tactics are responsible for your inability to win in this situation
this falls under your skill as a player and not a defficiency in your character
an experienced pvping dexxer will tell you it only takes 1 cure to basically have a mage on his heels and soon Koed

[venox]

because you a censoring the whole purpose for a pvp template.
blackfoot. in one sense you are accepting poisoning as a pvp skill. because you have been quite adamant about comparing it to evaluating int. and the use that evaluating int has for the class of the pvp template.

i think everyone knows why wands and vanqs are not allowed.
they are perks found in the game. and something i dont see a character entirelly based on.

as with DP. which mind you i dont see a strong push for DP in a 1v1 situation since cure pots have also been taken off the list. no one want dp for 1v1.

a dexxer with the poison skill relies on poison to deal an alternative form of damage. lets say some1 makes this goofy template to emphasize further how so, this is for everyone not seeing it...:
100str 100dex 25int
poison
fencing
hiding
stealth
magery (70)
meditate
resising spell
detect hidden (30)

poison as crafting:
for joe to make his keep he sells his service as brit bank.
"poisoned weapons for 100gp" he yells
and makes a sale.
and uses the money to purchase a magery book and a healing scroll...
there thats understandable, in the sense that you perceive poisoning as a crafting skill and is the reason why none poisoners should not have it.

poison as pvp pvm/ and see the similarity to magery.
and earth elemental has kidnapped his daughter and he must rescue her...
joe gathers his supplies to seek vengeance.
a pouch of poison (reagents)
a dagger
and some regs

upton entering the dungeon he meets a earth elemental, what is he to do?
he poisons his weapon (pre-casts an eb).
lunges at the elemental (releases the eb)
the elemental is poisoned and slowly dies....

a second elemental has entered the scene and he only has one dagger that has run out of poison(no magery spells are pre-cast).
joe grabs a second poison potion and applies it to his dagger (loads another eb)

dont you see the pattern here. how would poor old joe not stand a chance vs the elemental if he could not inflict it with poison. (dont say buy a poison weapon cause that would be using it like the 1st half of the story)...
it would be the same as not allowing magery to cast any spell let alone the poison spell. or even dexxers using melee weapons.
poison is his art and his way of doing damage. how is that not pvp/m???

im sorry for telling such a pathetic story.but i felt i was given no choice but to reduce it into lemans terms to illustrate how it is a pvp skill.

you are simply censoring alternatives to the tank mage.
for a character to apply poison to a blade. the principle is no different to a mage.

[draggle]

Hypothetical situation.

wow thanks for the contribution
and missing the point
my dexxer cna cast this spell why cant you

My dexxer has 0 magery but effectively uses cure scrolls. I also have 100 points locked in the poisoning skill. Why can't i use this as another tactic to try and win a heavily mage favored event?

why do i as a dexxer so badly need such a huge advantage to compete

Where is the huge advantage? I honestly don't see it. DP would be a huge advantage, but GP can easily be cured and healed through if you are a character with magery (as you claim any real contender in these tournies has) or with a cure scroll. It is true that it does not cost any mana like casting the spell does, but it does cost 100 skill points, which are far more valuable in pvp than 9 mana.

i still dont see whats wrong with the current system that would require this change
there is no advantage to a mage over a dexxer, both have pros and cons and both have a chance to win

Both mages and dexxers would benefit from this since as you've stated this skill does not belong to any one character type.


I simply do see any good reasons why mages can poison but dexxers (- magery + poisoning) can't.

[Flash Hardstar]

In a nutshell, what blackfoot is saying is:

"oh god no, never! don't allow poisoning for dexers in duels because then it would make it somewhat harder to kill these guys, I prefer killing them with ease - one less obstacle to cross to get my trophy! I also think duels should only be allowed for mages because thats the uber class! You shouldn't be able to duel unless you're a mage cause thats the only skilled uber class! No, you can't take our spell to poison away, i'm aware its unfair but then I'd actually have to fight them dexer in a 1v1 tourneyrather than poison and run, poison and run. I don't care that a dexer gets poisoned and can't chug, or even heal for almost 40 seconds which is undoubetdly unfair, but if they can poison I want potions to cure it so it doesnt affect me at all and essentially nothing would change..Magery is the only wya to go, yeah! Ooo ooo! If they get poison I wand wands too! I would like anything more that would make it so the fights were still in favor of us mages so that super-non-elite class dexers can't compete! Don't do it Derrick, it will ruin the tourneys forever! they will be doomed, DOOMED! (the last part is classic of how governments in history for thousands of years have used fear tactics to keep/implimant laws... History 101+102, undergrad level)

[kill drizitz]

CONGRATULATIONS. Man up like the rest of the ENTIRE era, and just stfu.
You play a shitty PvP template and want benefits. Get real!