Forum karma

[Hemperor]

what is the point of it?

If its to try and inform new players of the possible quality of the responses they receive or to reward big helpers or accuracy players then why can other and trash talk posts be rated?

[Hemperor]

I ask because I fear this can interfere with ingame opportunities (merchants for example) and anyone can be trolled by any group anonymously for no legitmate reason.

Neat feature but unnecessary and detrimental to our old school experience if anything, IMO

[Derrick]

They cannot be as of a couple days ago.

I'm not sure if it's as abusable as it may appear, but time will tell.

[Hemperor]

Sorry for multiple posts, I am on mobile. I think rating individual posts can work great and serve what I imagine Derrick's initial motives were but overall rating shouldn't exist. Correct me if I'm misunderstanding

[Derrick]

Aye, the post ratings data may be helpful as the data grows. It's be nice to have a system more like StackOverflow for a Q&A section; maybe the post ratings can morph into that.

However, I don't see it being harmful in the long term. There are far more rude players than fair so far, but i think people are a little enthusiastic about trying to damage rep at this time. I expect that novelty to wear off.

[GuardianKnight]

.

[chumbucket]

*goes through all of chumbucket's posts and down votes* HAH GOT YOU.....

But I am the nicest guy in UOSA according to you!

[Hemperor]

. I expect that novelty to wear off.

Ya when stable masters stable

Thanks for clearing other/trash talk issue up

[chumbucket]

Comment from another thread:

Being a passive aggressive jerk, forum whiner, entitled douche, secret cheater, etc., is the kind of thing that causes bad karma. Being a fun loving guy who isn't going to hide that he plays UO as a thief, apparently, helps. I think the karma system has some value. It is a rough gauge of the community's opinion. Obviously, people with lots of friends and guild members will receive a boost, but that is just because they are a big part of a community. People who make a show of being "good guys" but aren't are going to get down-voted more than even people who openly steal and scam. There is nothing that people hate more than phonies and hypocrites. Anyways, off topic.

As always, trust no one in trades. The forum karma system should only give you a sense of what kind of players people are generally thought to be. Telamon is right: it doesn't necessarily give you a sense of who is popular among who. If I were new or ever bothered to buy things that needed brokers, I would never trust anyone but one or two people with much to lose from running scams. (My current policy is Blackfoot only!)

UOSA is a game where people can harm you with only in-game repercussions. For many, those are worth it. So, new players: always, always, always assume the worst and take as many precautions as you can when engaged in big ticket transactions! Use forum karma as more of a rough, fallible guide to who is and isn't a jerk, keeping in mind that being a jerk and being a player who will harm you are not the same thing in a sandbox game. As GuardianKnight says of me, I am one of the nicest players in game but I will steal every damn thing you own if you give me half a chance. There are, to look at it from the other end, players who will not harm you in game so as to preserve their reputation but are clearly not nice people you would want to play with.

So I think there is some real value in the system for new players. For old players with settled opinions about others, it is only an idle amusement. I assume no real repercussions come from low levels of karma.

As to accuracy, I don't see the issue. The forums are not the game, and so nothing done with the forums is matter of accuracy, especially since that is defined in terms of mechanical accuracy.

[GuardianKnight]

Comment from another thread:

Being a passive aggressive jerk, forum whiner, entitled douche, secret cheater, etc., is the kind of thing that causes bad karma. Being a fun loving guy who isn't going to hide that he plays UO as a thief, apparently, helps. I think the karma system has some value. It is a rough gauge of the community's opinion. Obviously, people with lots of friends and guild members will receive a boost, but that is just because they are a big part of a community. People who make a show of being "good guys" but aren't are going to get down-voted more than even people who openly steal and scam. There is nothing that people hate more than phonies and hypocrites. Anyways, off topic.

As always, trust no one in trades. The forum karma system should only give you a sense of what kind of players people are generally thought to be. Telamon is right: it doesn't necessarily give you a sense of who is popular among who. If I were new or ever bothered to buy things that needed brokers, I would never trust anyone but one or two people with much to lose from running scams. (My current policy is Blackfoot only!)

UOSA is a game where people can harm you with only in-game repercussions. For many, those are worth it. So, new players: always, always, always assume the worst and take as many precautions as you can when engaged in big ticket transactions! Use forum karma as more of a rough, fallible guide to who is and isn't a jerk, keeping in mind that being a jerk and being a player who will harm you are not the same thing in a sandbox game. As GuardianKnight says of me, I am one of the nicest players in game but I will steal every damn thing you own if you give me half a chance. There are, to look at it from the other end, players who will not harm you in game so as to preserve their reputation but are clearly not nice people you would want to play with.

So I think there is some real value in the system for new players. For old players with settled opinions about others, it is only an idle amusement. I assume no real repercussions come from low levels of karma.

As to accuracy, I don't see the issue. The forums are not the game, and so nothing done with the forums is matter of accuracy, especially since that is defined in terms of mechanical accuracy.

Upvote for you. You are sucha good boy, yes you are!

[ScoobyDoO]

They cannot be as of a couple days ago.

I'm not sure if it's as abusable as it may appear, but time will tell.

From personal experience, it is bad. Like hemp said, you can simply have a group of let's say 4 or 5 people simply keep giving each other good rep, the higher the rep, the higher then impact it will have if they give a good or bad rating to another player. Not sure if thats how its set up, but back on other forums, we use to do this for the hell of it, and when we got high enough rep to do so, we played a joke on the GM's forums and negative rep them, giving them terrible reputation on the forums. Yeah they can simply override this when they see it, but I'm just saying, people can be targeted for no reason.

[ScoobyDoO]

And chum, I think it's easy enough for new players to simply throw the persons name in the search bar and bam, you got an instant record of anything that was said bad about the player that he should be aware of. For example, your rep is good, that's because you have a certain group of people that love ya, but even though you admitted that's stealing is part of the game, and you would rob someone blind if they allowed you too, isn't this something the new players should be aware of? But based on your rep, can they now trust you completely? Just saying. Nothing against ya.

[Border Patrol]

And chum, I think it's easy enough for new players to simply throw the persons name in the search bar and bam, you got an instant record of anything that was said bad about the player that he should be aware of. For example, your rep is good, that's because you have a certain group of people that love ya, but even though you admitted that's stealing is part of the game, and you would rob someone blind if they allowed you too, isn't this something the new players should be aware of? But based on your rep, can they now trust you completely? Just saying. Nothing against ya.

Only thing about the forum search thing is that most new players do not use it. I do not know how many times some one has asked a question in IRC that I reply with "In forums use the forum search feature and type 'blah blah blah' in the search box."

The only time I really tell them that is if it is going to be a really long drawn out complicated answer. Like "swing timers on certain weps with different levels of dex" kinda stuff. If the answer is quite simple and short I will give the information to the best of my ability though.

As for the forum karma it could very easily be abused by a small number of players most certainly.

[chumbucket]

I still think forum karma is of minor value and quite amusing.

No player should put much stock in it, and the only stock they should put in it at all would concern how nice a person is generally speaking. And, as I have said already, that does not translate into whether the person will kill you, steal from you, etc.. This is a game and those are parts of the game. It can, however, tip you off that some, even people who behave well, are unpleasant people. Certainly, it isn't fool proof. Even a very nice might get down-voted due to the cA Karma Conspiracy (TM), but, typically, low karma indicates an unpleasant person (though there is one major flaw discussed below).

A few possible improvements on the system:

1. You can only rate a player once ever, but that rating can be taken back or changed. Maybe the same for posts too.
2. Ratings are only 1 or -1.
3. People with negative karma can still rate others. Right now, I think the system is distorted because if some group gets downvoted quickly by another group, then they cannot retaliate. And the retaliation is useful, since karma is only a function of popularity with others players. Lack of retaliation makes the aggressors seem more popular than they are.
4. We as a community need to make absolutely clear to new players the limits of the system. Point them towards me: I have very high karma right now, but they cannot trust me at all.
5. Perhaps a limited number of votes per day per account? Could help with the retaliation problem above by slowing down votes so that no one gets destroyed instantly by the cA Karma Conspiracy, etc.

[Malaikat]

I don't see the mechanism for rating posts...I've been through my settings and didn't see anything there that was of of place. What am I missing?