Attack Last Spam

[Derrick]

I believe the existance of a global packet throttle may be the key to a lot of the issues in question, it may also relate to the spell recovery issue. It's clear in the demo that there is a significant delay between any type of action. I'm aware that the demo is not proof of this, especicially of the length of the delay which "feels" unnaturally long to me, so more research into this is definiately waranted. For server stability it would definiately be indicated (by OSI) to limit the amount of incoming packets that actually get serious processing. Most of the "you must wait to perform another action" messages on UOSA have been implemented on a case be case basis.

[MatronDeWinter]

I played a thief/dexer for most of my 97-2001 uo-span. If I hid from someone, and kept tabbing in and out, they could not reveal me with potions and attack last. If the "you could do it, because I did it all the time" argument comes up, (thats so common here, just look at the multi-clienting and ghosting threads), that is just a silly argument point. Odds are, I had to have encountered someone who "did this all the time" too, but still, I was never revealed. Sometimes I died from the potion damage, sometimes I hopped off my horse (guard whack in town) but I never was revealed unless they cast reveal, used detect hidden (which was extremely rare to have on a character that is capable of fighting anything) or I unhid for a split second to bandage myself and then immediately hide again. (Which was completely plausable to pull off, regardless of how much they spammed attack last, though eventually, you would reveal at the time their attack last kicked in and get hit) it had to be throttled, no doubt.

[malice-tg]

I know Last Target/Attack Last was a UO Macro, what I'm saying is there was no instance of Last Target/Attack Last spamming in T2A which leads me to believe that there was probably a delay on how often you could use it.

I certainly do remember people using Attack Last to take away someones hit, but it was possible to tab out and they wouldn't be able to Attack Last you again for a moment.

well i did this on my dexer and my mage sometimes. so i would say this is not true.

i gave a couple examples off auto defend not having any limits from hider fighting which pvp'ers from era should remember.

i understnd why you dont like it... i play a mage and also am annoyed by attack lst spamming at times but you're basing the idea of a fix something that i m very certain worked spamming on osi. because i did it.

[Tronica]

I know Last Target/Attack Last was a UO Macro, what I'm saying is there was no instance of Last Target/Attack Last spamming in T2A which leads me to believe that there was probably a delay on how often you could use it.

I certainly do remember people using Attack Last to take away someones hit, but it was possible to tab out and they wouldn't be able to Attack Last you again for a moment.

well i did this on my dexer and my mage sometimes. so i would say this is not true.

i gave a couple examples off auto defend not having any limits from hider fighting which pvp'ers from era should remember.

i understnd why you dont like it... i play a mage and also am annoyed by attack lst spamming at times but you're basing the idea of a fix something that i m very certain worked spamming on osi. because i did it.

i do not remember spamming atk last.

i remember staeling instas by re-attacking, but i do not remember it the way it is here.

people did not just hold it down and steal all instas

and likely, if you could have done so back then, people would have been doing it.

and who remembers it being that way?

[malice-tg]

I played a thief/dexer for most of my 97-2001 uo-span. If I hid from someone, and kept tabbing in and out, they could not reveal me with potions and attack last. If the "you could do it, because I did it all the time" argument comes up, (thats so common here, just look at the multi-clienting and ghosting threads), that is just a silly argument point. Odds are, I had to have encountered someone who "did this all the time" too, but still, I was never revealed. Sometimes I died from the potion damage, sometimes I hopped off my horse (guard whack in town) but I never was revealed unless they cast reveal, used detect hidden (which was extremely rare to have on a character that is capable of fighting anything) or I unhid for a split second to bandage myself and then immediately hide again. (Which was completely plausable to pull off, regardless of how much they spammed attack last, though eventually, you would reveal at the time their attack last kicked in and get hit) it had to be throttled, no doubt.

the reveal did not require hitting attac last. using aoe. all you did was start a purple or aoe spell while adjacent to the player and they auto defended and revealed for an ebolt. the only way it wouldnt work is if you were not adjacent to a player. in this situation you could tab out because u did not instantly punch or auto hit the purple tosser.

i think people are being confused by all these free servers this was such a common method its amazing to me that nobody is backing me up.

stealthers would complain because 20.1 tracking + purple negated 200 skill points they invested.

oh and im not talking about tossing pots in town. that was always a bad idea.

you claiming that you "never" got revealed really hurts your credibility on this issue with me. unless aoe didnt work in trammel towns? im talking about t2a era.

[malice-tg]

I know Last Target/Attack Last was a UO Macro, what I'm saying is there was no instance of Last Target/Attack Last spamming in T2A which leads me to believe that there was probably a delay on how often you could use it.

I certainly do remember people using Attack Last to take away someones hit, but it was possible to tab out and they wouldn't be able to Attack Last you again for a moment.

well i did this on my dexer and my mage sometimes. so i would say this is not true.

i gave a couple examples off auto defend not having any limits from hider fighting which pvp'ers from era should remember.

i understnd why you dont like it... i play a mage and also am annoyed by attack lst spamming at times but you're basing the idea of a fix something that i m very certain worked spamming on osi. because i did it.

i do not remember spamming atk last.

i remember staeling instas by re-attacking, but i do not remember it the way it is here.

people did not just hold it down and steal all instas

and likely, if you could have done so back then, people would have been doing it.

and who remembers it being that way?

insta hit was a very delicate thing you had to protect when faced with a dexer attack last spaming you or a mage.

on catskills if this happened it would result in temporarily not using the hally until some space could be generated. most tanks on catskills carried a katana so it was no problem.

i never played aos or a free server. i remember auto defend the way it was. i knew autodefend was wrong when i first came here as it is not the default i guess on the free server code templates. pots and aoes werent working making invise items too strong.

making duels better is no excuse to break a mechanic which affcts many areas of the game outside of duels.

[malice-tg]

listen i just want to be clear i have nothing against the posters or making suggestions.

im just replying so much becuse i remember this very well and didn't want a mistake put in because no opposition said anything.

[Choppa X]

listen i just want to be clear i have nothing against the posters or making suggestions.

im just replying so much becuse i remember this very well and didn't want a mistake put in because no opposition said anything.

You will still be able to attack last spam your heart out, it would just eliminate people holding down attack last and attacking with a katana. It would improve the quality of the server and make it fun once holding down attack last and this weird recast delay is put back to .75 or .50 instead of 1 second, and the interrupt delay is put it. How it is now is just retarded since if you disturb a gheal with a weaken, they will be able to cast another gheal before you can cast a clumsy. Once these are fixed, I think the server will be fun to play again.

[malice-tg]

You will still be able to attack last spam your heart out, it would just eliminate people holding down attack last and attacking with a katana. It would improve the quality of the server and make it fun once holding down attack last and this weird recast delay is put back to .75 or .50 instead of 1 second, and the interrupt delay is put it. How it is now is just retarded since if you disturb a gheal with a weaken, they will be able to cast another gheal before you can cast a clumsy. Once these are fixed, I think the server will be fun to play again.

ya the way it is now isnt working right. they need the int delay.

but katana attacking with attack last however annoying it may be is era accurate. i had many 1v1's break down into katana melee because of this on t2a osi catskills.

nobody i fought used the halby like you do on uosa on cats osi because of it. people would usually have one arm per cast not repeated halby arm disarms for one ebolt being held.

attack last is the counter measure to your current style of pvp.

[Jiggo]

You will still be able to attack last spam your heart out, it would just eliminate people holding down attack last and attacking with a katana. It would improve the quality of the server and make it fun once holding down attack last and this weird recast delay is put back to .75 or .50 instead of 1 second, and the interrupt delay is put it. How it is now is just retarded since if you disturb a gheal with a weaken, they will be able to cast another gheal before you can cast a clumsy. Once these are fixed, I think the server will be fun to play again.

ya the way it is now isnt working right. they need the int delay.

but katana attacking with attack last however annoying it may be is era accurate. i had many 1v1's break down into katana melee because of this on t2a osi catskills.

nobody i fought used the halby like you do on uosa on cats osi because of it. people would usually have one arm per cast not repeated halby arm disarms for one ebolt being held.

attack last is the counter measure to your current style of pvp.

It would still be a perfect counter to it, it would just involve actually deliberately timing your attack last to make them lose their interrupt, rather then running up and laying your finger on the attack last button. If you miss it and they tab out afterwards, oops, try harder next time. Its not even a "counter", it just works better as it stands. Even if it just "pulsed" slower, it would keep its full current functionality while totally removing the abuse.

[Choppa X]

It would still be a perfect counter to it, it would just involve actually deliberately timing your attack last to make them lose their interrupt, rather then running up and laying your finger on the attack last button. If you miss it and they tab out afterwards, oops, try harder next time. Its not even a "counter", it just works better as it stands. Even if it just "pulsed" slower, it would keep its full current functionality while totally removing the abuse.

Exactly, that's all that I want done. It takes 0 skill to hold down a key to make people lose swings. You should have to time it well and at the perfect time instead.

[Derrick]

Seems like it's a bad week for me to be on vacation.

I really appreciate all the thoughts and discussion in this thread. I'm not in a position to do much code wise until tommorrow at the earliest as I'm on the road.

[Kaivan]

Like anything else in game, I expect that the attack last command was throttled to 0.25 seconds increments. For anyone who played with a character with hiding during T2A or UOR, if you had a faster connection, holding down a hide macro while attempting to break line of sight did not initially fill up your overhead messages with the "You cannot seem to hide right now." message. It took a little bit of time to actually reach the maximum displayed number of messages. Given that on high speed connections, the round trip for messages was roughly 60 ms during 1999 - 2001 for servers in a local time zone, if there was no packet throttling done at the server, you would have almost instantly filled your overhead message box with the resulting message (on average it would have taken less than a single tick to actually deal with 4 attempts to hide), but that was not the case then, and is not the case now on live OSI servers. The real trick is that any non-use/movement action also dealt with the 0.25 second tick timer, including tabbing in and out of combat, so there was throttling on both the defending player and offending player.

We don't know exactly what the exact delay timer was for things such as attack last, but if nothing else, I figured that I would throw out a little bit of anecdotal evidence that alludes to packet throttling existing in-era and even today on OSI servers.

[Mung]

I completely agree with Choppa on this subject, there is absolutely no skill involved in holding down attack last, its not even a tactic, 9/10 times your doing it cause you do ntot understand how to mount an offensive combo, and you simply hope that making them punch out after every offensive spell is your best chance at actually winning in the fight. I am completely for auto-defend, but you should not be able to hold in attack last and literally never let your opponent tab out ( not even for a flash) there should certainly be throttle limits on attack last and tab as well so that people do not spam either 'tactic' and they are used when needed not abused. If the spammer knew that he could only make his victim auto defend once every .5 secs that would be great; and i think that alone would stop the button holding....its just god damn annoying, no one kills the other person, and i completely admit to the fact when someone holds in attack last i almost have to do it to them to stay on even ground and not fall on the defensive. so if you are not going to implement something to solve this douchebag created problem, then i guess I am only pvping from now on with attack last button taped down


To me as well it would also seem that a dexxer would have been the prevelant class for pvp in our supposed T2A server, because since attack last spam has become a bit of a trend, I have been pvping on my medi dex and punching out every spell until they recall...o ya and i have like 90 dex so i can still stay offensive more than just katana and attack last spam on 25 dex tank mage...

[Derrick]

This thread is quite old. This throttle was added some time ago.