Taming Laughable?

[Hemperor]

On another note, taming must be 10x easier to gain on this shard. Back in the day, there were no spots to macro etc. etc., I just built a tamer to 94 in what is probably less than 5 hours that weren't afk... it is ridiculously easy, even at 94 I am still gaining at a steady rate.

On OSI I remember it being a major pain in the ass just to get to 60

Thats most every skill here hemp. Fencing, Macing, Wrestle, Swords, Magery, Evalint, Resist, Stealing, Stealthing, Lockpicking, Anatomy, Provocation, Peacemake, Music, and even poisoning are fast here.

Also, not a snide comment or anything, but I thought you never actually played during T2A.

You are right, that is every skill, but it's a little bit even more bogus with taming. I played on and off from 97 throughout T2A... Just as a little kid initially, my step dad played regularily during Pre-T2A.

[Mikel123]

This is hilarious. Why was it a pain in the ass to gain taming on an OSI shard? BECAUSE WE DIDN'T HAVE RAZOR BACK THEN. If I had to type my Use Skill: Taming shortcut, then target, every freaking time I wanted to tame an animal, you're damn right it would take forever. What % of the population had UOloop or UOextreme in 1999? Like 3% maybe?

[Mikel123]

On another note, taming must be 10x easier to gain on this shard. Back in the day, there were no spots to macro etc. etc., I just built a tamer to 94 in what is probably less than 5 hours that weren't afk... it is ridiculously easy, even at 94 I am still gaining at a steady rate.

On OSI I remember it being a major pain in the ass just to get to 60

and WTF do you mean "there were no spots to macro"? What portion of UOSA are you macroing in that didn't exist in T2A?!?!

[Ronk]

This is hilarious. Why was it a pain in the ass to gain taming on an OSI shard? BECAUSE WE DIDN'T HAVE RAZOR BACK THEN. If I had to type my Use Skill: Taming shortcut, then target, every freaking time I wanted to tame an animal, you're damn right it would take forever. What % of the population had UOloop or UOextreme in 1999? Like 3% maybe?

As ive always said, if we could remove razor and force people to use only the client then we'd see who the real pvpers are

But yeah, I think its safe to say that a combo of razor, the fact that most everyone is on broadband, and the fact that this shard has ~400 people as opposed to ~3000+ all contribute to why some skills are easier to macro.

[GuardianKnight]

Feel free to explain how to macro taming? You can only tame stuff one time and once you get to bulls they spawn so slow it takes forever to get 1 point at 80.

[Faust]

This is hilarious. Why was it a pain in the ass to gain taming on an OSI shard? BECAUSE WE DIDN'T HAVE RAZOR BACK THEN. If I had to type my Use Skill: Taming shortcut, then target, every freaking time I wanted to tame an animal, you're damn right it would take forever. What % of the population had UOloop or UOextreme in 1999? Like 3% maybe?

Overall population maybe 3% or a little more, but overall "pvp population" roughly 90% or more. UO Loop and Extreme didn't have macroing capabilities that Razor had though. The majority of the features were much more simplistic to some extent.

You are right about Razor though. This shard would benefit greatly if we used the Razor limiting script that would remove a significant amount of the features that didn't exist during this era.

[Downs]

Feel free to explain how to macro taming? You can only tame stuff one time and once you get to bulls they spawn so slow it takes forever to get 1 point at 80.

Not 100% AFK Macro but:
http://forum.uosecondage.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=6378

Once u lose gains with that set up, do what u gotta do to be able to tame HH and just set up in the HH room. U get griefed, but the gains are worth it

[Hoots]

I dont believe taming is accurate here... Ill just leave it at that. I voiced my concerns about the lack of information leading to the changes and the amount of speculative information included when the patch was being debated.

The problem was the PvP tamer was too powerful on this shard. Pop count is 100% of the reason why. The people who were the strongest supporters of the change and the loudest complainers on taming were the same people getting crushed by PvP tamers. There hally mages couldnt win those fights and dont think for a second that wasnt a big part of the changes.

Everything the PvP tamers were doing was possible on osi (from a technical standpoint) but not really possible due to pop count.

You couldnt have 10 mares on OSI bc the spawns were so camped that even getting 1 or 2 was a huge deal....It took me about 20 mins to tame a mare yesterday with my GM tamer... i didnt see 1 person when i was doing it. This would never be the case on OSI. To the same extend dragons and WW's were also camped and while easier to obtain, getting a force of 6-10 to PvP with was no easy task and took days if not weeks to replace.

Another pop count issue was that the 1 or 2 guys i remember trying to PvP with tamers would just end up getting ganked by 10+ players, killing the tamer then his pets... again, there just isnt the checks and balances in the player count to do that here.

I believe that from a code standpoint Taming was more accurate at the end of 08 than it is now. But from a shard standpoint... Tamer stregnth is probably more accurate now... If you understand what im saying....The taming 'gimp' was more of a workaround balance issue than accuracy change inho.

[Hemperor]

I dont believe taming is accurate here... Ill just leave it at that. I voiced my concerns about the lack of information leading to the changes and the amount of speculative information included when the patch was being debated.

The problem was the PvP tamer was too powerful on this shard. Pop count is 100% of the reason why. The people who were the strongest supporters of the change and the loudest complainers on taming were the same people getting crushed by PvP tamers. There hally mages couldnt win those fights and dont think for a second that wasnt a big part of the changes.

Everything the PvP tamers were doing was possible on osi (from a technical standpoint) but not really possible due to pop count.

You couldnt have 10 mares on OSI bc the spawns were so camped that even getting 1 or 2 was a huge deal....It took me about 20 mins to tame a mare yesterday with my GM tamer... i didnt see 1 person when i was doing it. This would never be the case on OSI. To the same extend dragons and WW's were also camped and while easier to obtain, getting a force of 6-10 to PvP with was no easy task and took days if not weeks to replace.

Another pop count issue was that the 1 or 2 guys i remember trying to PvP with tamers would just end up getting ganked by 10+ players, killing the tamer then his pets... again, there just isnt the checks and balances in the player count to do that here.

I believe that from a code standpoint Taming was more accurate at the end of 08 than it is now. But from a shard standpoint... Tamer stregnth is probably more accurate now... If you understand what im saying....The taming 'gimp' was more of a workaround balance issue than accuracy change inho.

It really angers me to hear you tamers cry still to this day, I know the effort that Derrick, Kaivan and others really put into that patch. It was on test for probably the longest time compared to other patches.

Thing is, all information and research pointed in a single direction, there was nothing saying otherwise. I think rather than crying every week in a new topic, you guys should do something productive. Go do some research and other testing, you won't find anything of course, but at least with that you may realise and respect the effort that goes into making these patches.

I'll repeat myself for the last time, staff don't even bother replying to these topics anymore because the research is indisputable (which you all reinforce with each crying, but zero evidence, post).

[Ronk]

I dont believe taming is accurate here... Ill just leave it at that. I voiced my concerns about the lack of information leading to the changes and the amount of speculative information included when the patch was being debated.

The problem was the PvP tamer was too powerful on this shard. Pop count is 100% of the reason why. The people who were the strongest supporters of the change and the loudest complainers on taming were the same people getting crushed by PvP tamers. There hally mages couldnt win those fights and dont think for a second that wasnt a big part of the changes.

Everything the PvP tamers were doing was possible on osi (from a technical standpoint) but not really possible due to pop count.

You couldnt have 10 mares on OSI bc the spawns were so camped that even getting 1 or 2 was a huge deal....It took me about 20 mins to tame a mare yesterday with my GM tamer... i didnt see 1 person when i was doing it. This would never be the case on OSI. To the same extend dragons and WW's were also camped and while easier to obtain, getting a force of 6-10 to PvP with was no easy task and took days if not weeks to replace.

Another pop count issue was that the 1 or 2 guys i remember trying to PvP with tamers would just end up getting ganked by 10+ players, killing the tamer then his pets... again, there just isnt the checks and balances in the player count to do that here.

I believe that from a code standpoint Taming was more accurate at the end of 08 than it is now. But from a shard standpoint... Tamer stregnth is probably more accurate now... If you understand what im saying....The taming 'gimp' was more of a workaround balance issue than accuracy change inho.

Makes perfect sense to me. I think population is a large reason that many things seem 'unbalanced' from what we remember. Killing a persons wyrm definitely seems less special when they can easily just pop to the nearest dungeon and grab another.

[GuardianKnight]

I dont believe taming is accurate here... Ill just leave it at that. I voiced my concerns about the lack of information leading to the changes and the amount of speculative information included when the patch was being debated.

The problem was the PvP tamer was too powerful on this shard. Pop count is 100% of the reason why. The people who were the strongest supporters of the change and the loudest complainers on taming were the same people getting crushed by PvP tamers. There hally mages couldnt win those fights and dont think for a second that wasnt a big part of the changes.

Everything the PvP tamers were doing was possible on osi (from a technical standpoint) but not really possible due to pop count.

You couldnt have 10 mares on OSI bc the spawns were so camped that even getting 1 or 2 was a huge deal....It took me about 20 mins to tame a mare yesterday with my GM tamer... i didnt see 1 person when i was doing it. This would never be the case on OSI. To the same extend dragons and WW's were also camped and while easier to obtain, getting a force of 6-10 to PvP with was no easy task and took days if not weeks to replace.

Another pop count issue was that the 1 or 2 guys i remember trying to PvP with tamers would just end up getting ganked by 10+ players, killing the tamer then his pets... again, there just isnt the checks and balances in the player count to do that here.

I believe that from a code standpoint Taming was more accurate at the end of 08 than it is now. But from a shard standpoint... Tamer stregnth is probably more accurate now... If you understand what im saying....The taming 'gimp' was more of a workaround balance issue than accuracy change inho.

It really angers me to hear you tamers cry still to this day, I know the effort that Derrick, Kaivan and others really put into that patch. It was on test for probably the longest time compared to other patches.

Thing is, all information and research pointed in a single direction, there was nothing saying otherwise. I think rather than crying every week in a new topic, you guys should do something productive. Go do some research and other testing, you won't find anything of course, but at least with that you may realise and respect the effort that goes into making these patches.

I'll repeat myself for the last time, staff don't even bother replying to these topics anymore because the research is indisputable (which you all reinforce with each crying, but zero evidence, post).

So basically you are telling a certain part of the player base to just shut their mouths and at the same time let the other player base people say whatever they want on the matter? I think you have this confused with north korea.

[Hemperor]

I dont believe taming is accurate here... Ill just leave it at that. I voiced my concerns about the lack of information leading to the changes and the amount of speculative information included when the patch was being debated.

The problem was the PvP tamer was too powerful on this shard. Pop count is 100% of the reason why. The people who were the strongest supporters of the change and the loudest complainers on taming were the same people getting crushed by PvP tamers. There hally mages couldnt win those fights and dont think for a second that wasnt a big part of the changes.

Everything the PvP tamers were doing was possible on osi (from a technical standpoint) but not really possible due to pop count.

You couldnt have 10 mares on OSI bc the spawns were so camped that even getting 1 or 2 was a huge deal....It took me about 20 mins to tame a mare yesterday with my GM tamer... i didnt see 1 person when i was doing it. This would never be the case on OSI. To the same extend dragons and WW's were also camped and while easier to obtain, getting a force of 6-10 to PvP with was no easy task and took days if not weeks to replace.

Another pop count issue was that the 1 or 2 guys i remember trying to PvP with tamers would just end up getting ganked by 10+ players, killing the tamer then his pets... again, there just isnt the checks and balances in the player count to do that here.

I believe that from a code standpoint Taming was more accurate at the end of 08 than it is now. But from a shard standpoint... Tamer stregnth is probably more accurate now... If you understand what im saying....The taming 'gimp' was more of a workaround balance issue than accuracy change inho.

It really angers me to hear you tamers cry still to this day, I know the effort that Derrick, Kaivan and others really put into that patch. It was on test for probably the longest time compared to other patches.

Thing is, all information and research pointed in a single direction, there was nothing saying otherwise. I think rather than crying every week in a new topic, you guys should do something productive. Go do some research and other testing, you won't find anything of course, but at least with that you may realise and respect the effort that goes into making these patches.

I'll repeat myself for the last time, staff don't even bother replying to these topics anymore because the research is indisputable (which you all reinforce with each crying, but zero evidence, post).

So basically you are telling a certain part of the player base to just shut their mouths and at the same time let the other player base people say whatever they want on the matter? I think you have this confused with north korea.

You are correct.

Don't post unless you have something productive to add. Telling the staff they screwed up, even though they make public their research of these changes, without providing research on your own is pointless, repetitive and hurting your own cause.

[Hoots]

Makes perfect sense to me. I think population is a large reason that many things seem 'unbalanced' from what we remember. Killing a persons wyrm definitely seems less special when they can easily just pop to the nearest dungeon and grab another.

That i believe is the biggest issue. The cry (and i do mean cry) that went out against tamers was that they couldnt do this on OSI and something had to be screwed up. I believe you could actually do everything on OSI you could do here dec '08. It just wasnt really possible because of the difficulty in obtaining pets. People on OSI would never IMAGINE PvPing with a stable of mares, and here it was no big deal.

On OSI the PvP tamer was a very very rare character... But it had nothing to do with game mechanics. It was all about difficuly in obtaining and in most cases replacing Pets.

When we guilded on OSI it was always 10+ vs 10+... our entire guild's goal was to "keep the tamer alive" bc he was going to get a 10 player dump as soon as he showed up. I think he tried to PvP with pets 2 or 3 times and quit bc it wasnt worth the time to retame after death (which was pretty common)... No Razor, 56ks, shards lags and crashes.... Being a tamer was MUCH harder then than it is now... Lag next to a drag or WW anyone?

[Faust]

How about we end this thread?

Prove Kaivan's taming research wrong or stop posting with complaints and whining. This server is about t2a accuracy nothing else.

Simple, end topic.

[Mikel123]

I dont believe taming is accurate here... Ill just leave it at that. I voiced my concerns about the lack of information leading to the changes and the amount of speculative information included when the patch was being debated.

The problem was the PvP tamer was too powerful on this shard. Pop count is 100% of the reason why. The people who were the strongest supporters of the change and the loudest complainers on taming were the same people getting crushed by PvP tamers. There hally mages couldnt win those fights and dont think for a second that wasnt a big part of the changes.

Everything the PvP tamers were doing was possible on osi (from a technical standpoint) but not really possible due to pop count.

You couldnt have 10 mares on OSI bc the spawns were so camped that even getting 1 or 2 was a huge deal....It took me about 20 mins to tame a mare yesterday with my GM tamer... i didnt see 1 person when i was doing it. This would never be the case on OSI. To the same extend dragons and WW's were also camped and while easier to obtain, getting a force of 6-10 to PvP with was no easy task and took days if not weeks to replace.

Another pop count issue was that the 1 or 2 guys i remember trying to PvP with tamers would just end up getting ganked by 10+ players, killing the tamer then his pets... again, there just isnt the checks and balances in the player count to do that here.

I believe that from a code standpoint Taming was more accurate at the end of 08 than it is now. But from a shard standpoint... Tamer stregnth is probably more accurate now... If you understand what im saying....The taming 'gimp' was more of a workaround balance issue than accuracy change inho.

It really angers me to hear you tamers cry still to this day, I know the effort that Derrick, Kaivan and others really put into that patch. It was on test for probably the longest time compared to other patches.

Thing is, all information and research pointed in a single direction, there was nothing saying otherwise. I think rather than crying every week in a new topic, you guys should do something productive. Go do some research and other testing, you won't find anything of course, but at least with that you may realise and respect the effort that goes into making these patches.

I'll repeat myself for the last time, staff don't even bother replying to these topics anymore because the research is indisputable (which you all reinforce with each crying, but zero evidence, post).

This is lame. The research is far from indisuputable, that's why there was such a damn long thread on it. It's interpretation. Your attempts to trivialize the confusion and assumption around it by constantly talking about "crying", "whining", and "indisputable" are pathetic. You sound like a politician. Or a child.

And you clearly have some sort of angst against taming as a skill choice. I'm not sure why. How many tamers are on this shard "pvping" with their tamers? There's no such thing. If you see a tamer that attacks you, you have two options: run away, or fight them. PvP is consensual.

There's 81 times as many GM swords/fence/mace/archer characters on this shard as GM tamers. Is there really some kind of "imbalance" here? Sorry, I just don't see it. I can macro a Provoker in 3 days that makes gold at 95% of the rate of a tamer... probably faster, when you consider the time it takes to find and tame a couple dragons/mares to hunt with.